IAP Political Forum

Atlantic City Mayor Drops Out of Sight
By WAYNE PARRY,AP
Posted: 2007-10-06 13:21:32
ATLANTIC CITY, N.J. (Oct. 6) -- Under federal investigation for embellishing his Army service in Vietnam, a groggy-sounding Mayor Robert Levy called in sick at City Hall, climbed into his city-issued Dodge Durango and seemingly dropped off the face of the Earth.

A spokesman issued a 36-word statement saying the mayor was going on indefinite medical leave. That was a week and a half ago. Aides say he is in a hospital, but they won't say where, why or for how long.

The mystery and the gathering scandal over Levy 's military record have worried civic leaders in this seaside casino resort, which has a long history of corruption, with four of the last eight mayors busted on graft charges and one-third of last year's nine-member City Council in prison or under house arrest.

"It's a national embarrassment," said City Councilman Bruce Ward, who asked a judge Friday to declare the mayor's seat officially vacant and clear the way for the council to name a replacement.

"We have entertainment companies that are considering investing billions of dollars in Atlantic City. They need to know there is stability in Atlantic City. And we have 40,000 residents here who need to be protected."

Last fall, The Press of Atlantic City investigated Levy 's accounts of his wartime service and used military records to verify that Levy was a 20-year Army veteran with two Bronze Stars and two tours of duty in Vietnam. But the newspaper found he was not a member of the storied Green Berets, as he had claimed.

Shortly afterward, Levy , former head of Atlantic City's lifeguards, admitted misrepresenting his record.

"I'm sorry for having this happen at all," Levy told The Associated Press in November. "It's something I should have corrected 40 years ago. It is what it is, and I apologize for the embarrassment I've created for myself and my family."


http://news.aol.com/story/ar/_a/atlantic-city-mayor-drops-out-of-sight/20071005174009990001?ncid=NWS00010000000001

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/warner-todd-huston/2007/10/06/atlantic-city-mayor-phony-soldier-under-investigation-democrat

Wonder why this is so important? Remember how you liberals accused Bush of being AWOL but cried like little sissies when Kerry's service was put to question? Well it seems that democrats have a problem with making up military careers not only to pad their resume but also to cheat taxpayers out of our money......crooks and liars...the democRatic way.....

Kerry served.

Bush didn't.

What part of this am I missing? What makes Kerry a hypocrit? Why is Bush better in this regard? Please help me cause I'm an idiot liberal.

::)

By the way, your powers of segway... uhh... suck. Bad. The more imprtant issue is that Atlantic City has no mayor, and you're wasting time over his military service and how this relates to Limbaugh?

I think you need to sort out your priorities, pal.

I am not your "pal" asshole.....

Bush didn't serve? Then how did he get his wings? And you call putting yourself in for commendations "served"? The haul ass after a couple boo boo's out of country?

Real men like Col. North who was wounded four times and still stayed with his men is what I called "served". Not running away after a couple band-aids.

Astonishing. Is this normal?









...seriously.

Completely uncalled for... but who am I to think the likes of you can be civil ::) .


Uhhh... cause he flew a few planes IN THIS COUNTRY. It's not like he actually saw action or was in any real danger of being killed.



Yeah... what a liberal pussy HE was...


Probably needed more than a band aid. I'm sure his comrade thanked him too, considerng a band aid wouldn't have helped him much if he drowned.


Yeah. Getting shot in the leg is nothing.

SOURCE (http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,994120,00.html)


You're ability to be partisan is staggering... and sad.


Col. North does sound like a great man... but I fail to see how this makes the wounds suffered by Kerry "trivial".

Dpes Bush have any wounds from his time in Vietnam? Oh wait... he never went. That's right.


For Dog Face 11B? Usually.

 For dogface, much to our dismay, this is normally the way he posts...unfortunatly there is nothing "normal" about dogface

I was referring to the fact that he's the only one who knows that Bush, Who learned how to fly a jet in the NG and has been Commander in Chief of the United States Armed Forces for years and yeard....ever served
It's hard to tell if the rest understand that, and are just being laconic, sophmoric little mop-pushers, or if they are completley ignorant to the facts but feel compelled for some reason to argue them anyway.

And some people who have NEVER served in the military have become president.

What's your point?

His point is, that someone like you who claims to be in the military would claim your commander in chief didnt serve.

So just because you havent seen combat like President Bush, you are not serving in the military and your service means nothing...... ::) this is why I think your full of bullshit

One difference.

Bush signed up to BE in the military. I did not.

Of course, I know this distinction must escape your tiny mind, so I guess I actually had to tell it to you.

::)

When did the draft become reinstated? Were you forced to raise your right hand and swear an oath to this country, the commander in chief and to uphold the Constitution?

Or are you one of those idiots that joined the military thinking that you would never actually have to serve and steal taxpayers money to finance your college education?

I serious doubt you wear the uniform...any uniform......and if you do, you must be one sorry example of the worst of our armed service has to offer.

Actually, I'm 20 years old getting a Bachelor of Engineering in Naval Architecture to design ships for the NAVY and Coast Guard so they can better defend this country.

I'm also pursuing a 3rd Assistant Engineer's lisence in the Coast Guard so if I *DO* go into any official service, be it the Coast Guard or the NAVY Reserve, I will be equipped to help in the best way I can. Or, I could join MSC (Military Sealift Command) to make sure the troops get there food, weapons, vehicles and body armor.

Did you know it's possible to serve this country in more ways than joining the army?


Yeah... and you represent the best? ::)

And it's no wonder people hate you so much...

There are a lot of things doggie thinks he knows. Here is what the rest of us know:
http://www.factcheck.org/democratic_groups_ad_revives_awol_allegation_against.html

 Facts are doggie that junior is a coward and being a rich kid with a daddy in office he got out of serving in any real way, then went missing doing that. The rest of the world knows it and we have moved on . You and the other neocon waterboys somehow cling on to the notion that he was some kind of a hero ...wishful thinking or pure delusion I don't care.  GET REAL.

Oh, so you mean like former Senator Max Cleland, who lost both legs and an arm in combat serving this natiion but was still accused by Saxby Chambliss of being unpatriotic, even being shown in the same frame as Osama Bin Laden in television ads? 

An ad unveiled Sept. 8 by the Democratic-leaning group "Texans for Truth" features a former officer in the Alabama Air National Guard saying neither he nor his friends saw George W. Bush at their unit The TV spot adds little to what was already known. Bush's pay records -- released nearly in 1972, when Bush was temporarily assigned there. seven months earlier -- reflect a six-month gap in paid attendance during a time when he was working on an Alabama Senate campaign.

There were these other developments:

A Boston Globe report Sept. 8 concluded that Bush "fell well short of meeting his military obligation" because of irregular attendance at Guard drills. The Globe said Bush's superiors "could have disciplined him or ordered him to active duty in 1972, 1973 or 1974. But they did neither."
The Associated Press reported Sept. 8 that newly obtained records show Bush's Texas unit continued operating the type of airplane that Bush was trained to fly until 1974, long after Bush's last flight in April 1972. Bush aides once suggested that a reason he stopped flying and later skipped a flight physical, leading to his official grounding, was that his services weren't needed because the F-102 Delta Dagger planes were being phased out.
The CBS program 60 Minutes aired an interview Sept. 8 with former Texas Lt. Gov. Ben Barnes, who said he used his political influence to get Bush into the Texas Air National Guard in 1968, when the Vietnam war was raging. "I would describe it as preferential treatment," said Barnes, a Democrat who is supporting Kerry. "We had a lot of young men that left and went to Canada in the '60s and fled this country. But those that could get in the Reserves, or those that could get in the National Guard -- chances are they would not have to go to Vietnam."


I'd say he knows what they, and everybody else knows...That Bush served, and saying he did not, and comparing him to War criminals & Hitler makes anybody who says Bush didn't serve a modern-day Chambliss...just as relying on an organization like factcheck.org is reflective of right-wing bias.

I've often wondered what happened to the poor sap whose place in the Texas Air National Guard Bush usurped? Did the guy end up in Vietnam? Did he come home?

Do you suppose Bush spends many nights awake, wondering the same thing?

Nah, I don't either...

Has there ever been any evidence that Bush's father was called on to pull strings or is this more supposition?

ps: has anyone looked into alGore's father pulling strings for him?



Just wondering

Has anyone else noticed that it is no longer 2004 and the elections are not being held anymore.  While I agree that Bush did serve (in the looses sense of the word), it should be acknowledged that Kerry served with honor and was a brave solider, even if you did not want him to be president.  People do not receive medals and respect of those that served under him by being a coward.  It is as if it would melt Dogface's eyes to acknowledge that Kerry served with honor (even if you don't agree with his actions after he was sent home).

Personally, to me, both men served and, as best as I can tell, honorably. Bush flew jets. Not too shabby for an idiot. Kerry was a leader of men.

We can agree or disagree with what they've both done since but I have never had a bad word to say about either of their service.

Do you consider all Vietnam vets, or those who have enlisted to serve in the last 6 years as "poor saps"?

"You know, education -- if you make the most of it -- you study hard, you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. If you don't, you get stuck in Iraq." --John Kerry

Bush is awake at night, Commanding....leading.. the entire United States Military in a time of war....as in combat expierence., disagree or not, like it or not, you don't end up...or get stuck as Commander in Cheif...you earn it, just like a medal.

You do know that quote was about Bush and not about those that serve in the military?  I doubt his comment was directed to those who do military service considering he went to Yale and then joined the military.  The reason it was spun to insult the military was due to the election.  Please ensure you use the quotes in correct context before attempting to use them to discredit someone who isn't even trying to run in 2008.

You do know that quote was about Bush and not about those that serve in the military?  I doubt his comment was directed to those who do military service considering he went to Yale and then joined the military.  The reason it was spun to insult the military was due to the election.  Please ensure you use the quotes in correct context before attempting to use them to discredit someone who isn't even trying to run in 2008.

"You know, education -- if you make the most of it -- you study hard, you do your homework and you make an effort to be smart, you can do well. If you don't, you get stuck in Iraq." --John Kerry


"I personally apologize to any service member, family member or American who was offended," --John Kerry



"Phony soldiers." --Rush Limbaugh...No Edit...that's the entire statement.

"Rush Limbaugh took it upon himself to attack the courage and character of those fighting and dying for him and for all of us." --Sen. Reid, on the Senate Floor

"I did apologize to the troops earlier today, FOR him [Reid] and FOR the Democrats and FOR the group that has fed this smear campaign, this bunch of lies that he knows is false, but he just wants to get this in the Congressional Record now."  --Rush Limbaugh, Broadcast on Armed forces Radio


"The reason it was spun to insult the military was due to the election.  Please ensure you use the quotes in correct context before attempting to use them to discredit someone who isn't even trying to run in 2008." --Perrin


No point, just quotes...who cares what i think?

Not enough people see things this way. Personally, I think both of them were poor choices for presidential candidates, but there's no reason to go bashing people's service. I myself have doubts as to how faithfully Bush Served his duty, as well as to whether ALL of Kerry's presented record is accurate. To assert that these doubts themselves amount to facts would be a mistake though.

IMO, the best course of action would be to assess their potential for leadership of the country. I voted for Nader.

Factchecking and dragging new facts into light is one thing, frivolous accusations are another.

interesting quotes, don't see a point in using my quotes to mean anything.  I haven't said anything against Rush in this respect yet.  So, why you my quotes?

Your quote i think explains the entire "Rush hates the military, so Republicans hate the military" attack, and the "Bush didn't serve" attack quite nicley.


You do know that quote was about Bush and not about those that serve in the military?

You do know that Bush, as CINC, serves in the military?
Bush, who just happens to serve in the United states military, is stupid....Now do I have the correct context?

This is why I compared the Kerry Remarks to being on of those "poor saps" who went to Vietnam. It's more of a stretch when put INTO "context"
It doesn't really matter at this point, as Bush (as CINC) has already recieved his personal apology.

Yeah, both basically exactly the same. Except, of course, that one served in Vietnam with distinction and the other had his daddy pull strings to make sure he was never in the same hemisphere as the bad guys.
But other than that, no difference.

I asked earlier about evidence that Bush 'pulled strings.' Do you have any or will just keep repeating that?

  Neue; Al gore is not the President of the United States Bush junior is.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/campaigns/wh2000/stories/bush072899.htm

Nice effort Freethinker (referring to your post, immediately above). However, I doubt you'll ever find a source acceptable to neue regal. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I doubt it. If he's resisted knowing all this time, I doubt he'll be persuaded by mere articles in the "left wing media."

Your probably correct, Neue's ability to stonewall in the face of incontrovertible evidence is well documented here. But I just can't sit by and let him pretend we're making this up. BTW this wasn't at all hard to find.

Here is some more evidence for neue...


http://www.boston.com/news... (http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/09/08/bush_fell_short_on_duty_at_guard/)


http://www.cnn.com/... (http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/09/13/bush.professor/)

And I will be surprised if neue even responds to all this evidence much less admit that Bush had "strings pulled" to get him in the guard.

 Neue?... Neue??...... Are you there Neue?????......(crickets chirping).............................

For one dimocrats....this thread is not about Bush...so get back on topic....

two, wonder why not one of you guys have addressed this democrat caught lying and admitting he lied about his military service.

three, even though you guys may like to believe that Bush didnt serve, at least he took the test and passed it, was a flier and never lied saying he was in Vietnam like democrat McBee who claimed he was a Ranger in Iraq or in the elite Special Forces unit like democrat Robert Levy.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, man I hate New Jersey.  Seriously, NJ and DC, maybe even Philly.  The corruption in those places is out of control, and I'm fairly convinced it would be the same no matter what party you put in there.

but the fact remains they are controlled by democrats and have been for a while.....

Damn, I hate it when a record gets stuck on the same note again and again and again.   :angel:

Ya you must hate it when someone repeats the facts ...but it still doesnt change the sound of the tune.....

 :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

That was funny.  Tell another.

Judging the national democratic party based on New Jersey is like basing your opinion of America on West Virginia.  The Democrats are a very diverse party and unlike the Republicans, it's ok to not be like everyone else.  Heck, look at Sen. Bob Casey Jr, of PA.  He's pro gun and pro life for cryin' out loud.

Glad to see you here!

OswaldTheOsprey

Yes, the mayor of AC is  a scum bag.

Not as a  big a scumbag as say, Rush Limbaugh, who escaped military service for anal fissures and, like you, insults real soldiers, because they don't join your party.

How pathetic are you?

I heard on TV, I forget where, that of all of the presidential candidates the one with the highest NRA rating was Governor Bill Richardson! He even addressed their convention via a hookup.

OswaldTheOsprey

Actually, according to your original post, it WAS about Bush.

"Wonder why this is so important? Remember how you liberals accused Bush of being AWOL but cried like little sissies when Kerry's service was put to question? Well it seems that democrats have a problem with making up military careers not only to pad their resume but also to cheat taxpayers out of our money......crooks and liars...the democRatic way....."

YOU said it was important and mentioned Bush first. We just commented on your topic.


WHAT!? A Democrat lied? Say it ain't so.

::)

I hate when we go through these stupid threads. ALL politicians, regardless of party, lie to save power. In a week we'll have a post up here about a Republican in a similar situation... so why do I bother...

Listen here libtard...I did over 20 years in the Army dick-stick.....but from your idiotic post I see you don't know jack about the military or too stupid to see my member name...dog face is a nickname for a soldier in a infantry unit.....11B is the  job description and qualification factors for United States Army soldier who serves in a infantry unit......damn you liberals get dumber and dumber each day.....

Golly gee whiz! What a classy post! ::) ::) ::)

OswaldTheOsprey

Doggie face: Toaster never said a thing about your service or lack thereof.
He compared you to, Mr anal fissures, draft dodgeing Limbaugh, in the way you insult soldiers who don't join with your party. Interesting that you inferred that.

Show me boy where I have attacked a real soldier.....btw, in my book Kerry or anyone else that has to lie about their service to this country is no a real soldier....I have that right seeing that I served and did exactly what I claim to.....if you have any questions feel free to ask....but you won't get same out of Kerry or his likes.

Is your definition of a "real soldier" one that agrees with you?

OswaldTheOsprey

DF11B, when did Kerry lie about his service?

OK doggie boy Give us your honest oppinion about this guy:
 http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/2004/11/10_400.html
 Does he have a right to his view sharing with you the credibility and right to talk about the occupation , or is he a "phoney soldier"?

I actually saw him interviewed. He seems like a good guy. He was talking about how congress condeming both Limbaugh and Moveon were wastes of time. He wanted to know why congress was wasting their time and not working on trying to bring the troops home.

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003638726 (http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003638726)

Phoney soldiers? Perhaps Dogface would like to explain to their surviving families why they aren't "real" soldiers.

Here's their Op-Ed:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/19/opinion/19jayamaha.html?_r=1&oref=slogin (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/19/opinion/19jayamaha.html?_r=1&oref=slogin)

Ah yes, the pathetic bleat of those with no arguments or facts left in their tiny brains, and are left trying to impress us with their hum-drum little military careers. Do you reckon he wears his uniform to bed every night? Still wears a stupid-looking "high and tight?"

Do the medals poke you when you roll over?

(By the way, I bet I outrank you).
Really.

What was Limbaugh's?

Oh yeah.

4F.

Tot :I think we would all agree and like to know the answer to that one.

When did Kerry ever lie about his military record?  As far as I'm aware, the only people to lie about his record were the swift boaters, and they were discredited.  I mean, lying about your own record to look good, that's pretty despicable, but besmirching the military record of another who did serve honorably...I don't think they have a word for how wrong that is.

Since I'm on that note, I ask again:  Would you care to comment on Senator Chambliss having the gall to question the patriotism of Vietnam combat veteran and triple amputee fmr Sen. Max Cleland?

I guess no one on the left read "Winter Soldier"...it was full of lies and wrote by Kerry about his and others military service with the help of Jane Fonda.

heres another lie...

Kerry:






http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A27211-2004Aug23.html

Except that the ad didn't do that.  It did explain that Cleland voted 11 times against a homeland-security bill that would have given President Bush the freedom from union strictures that he wanted in order to set up the new department. That bill was co-sponsored by his Georgia colleague Sen. Zell Miller, a fellow Democrat.

Cleland's defenders seem to believe that informing voters of Cleland's record impugns his patriotism, and make the unwarrented assumption that Chambliss questioned Cleland's patriotism.

I don't care what your sexual orientation in the military was, although I am not familiar with the MOS that the name dick stick applies to, it really doesn't matter.

I know the terms, I am an honorably discharged E-5, so you may kindly go fornicate yourself, you worthless troll. This ought to work for you, seeing as how you are both a penis and a vagina at the same time.

You just insulted another vet. I know I am not insulting you, since obviously, you are a dick.

Run along, little boy. I have no time for worhtless trolls.

Thom Shanker is reporting in The New York Times that the U.S. Marine Corps is wanting to pull its forces from Iraq and concentrate in Afghanistan. Are the Marines "phony soldiers"? ::) ::) ::)

OswaldTheOsprey

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/11/washington/11military.html?hp=&pagewanted=print

Another stupid libtard....dont come in here boy questioning me a 20 year vet then whine like a little bitch when you get bitched slapped......

And buck...before you get exposed for the liar you are...think...I know it hard but before you open your mouth to get exposed...shut it punk.

Here's a clue for you, moron.

20 years as a vet gives you no more insight into politics than 20 years as a veterinarian.

What respect you deserve for you service, you squander in happily maligning other vets, like me.

You know nothing about me, and yet there you sit, treating your brothers like the piece of shit you are.

And that is what you are.

I respect the service of all who serve. But you pretty much prove you are a worthless 10 pound turd in a 6 ounce glass.

Run along, little boy. I don't need to lie on a message board, I'm not a pathetic loser, like you.

Welcome back Impaired

Thanks, good to be back.

Maybe it will be more regular.

Are you in the service yet? If so, DogFace will happily impugne your service and question your patriotism.

I also note that the VFW endorsed Chambliss largely on the basis of those same security votes.  Do any of you really think the VFW would have aided the kind of behaviour the Cleland complainers allege?

The ad was a montage of photos, including those of Hussein, Bin Laden, and Cleland, and implied that the man who gave three limbs for his country in combat lacked the courage to lead.  Maybe I'm being oversensitive, but it seems like a dick move to me. 

Maybe inaccurate.  The ad at one point does show Hussein and UBL with US forces in the other quadrants.  Those images never morph into Cleland.

Cleland, a senator from a reasonably conservative state, voted against security legislation under labor union pressure.  That is not a profile in courage, and I don't see how citing a sitting senator's voting record on an important issue is a "dick" move.

What strikes me as weak is Cleland's protest that they question his patriotism when Chambliss actually questioned was his performance and fitness to continue to represent the people of Georgia.

Wrong and wrong.

The issue in 2002 was civil service protections for Homeland Security employees, which Bush opposed and Cleland supported. The ad failed to point out that Cleland supported the creation of a Department of Homeland Security before Bush did. Cleland originally co-sponsored the enabling legislation and eventually supported it, but as the bill moved through Congress, he cast a number of votes against it in hopes of getting a better bill. The Republican attack ads made it look as though Cleland was voting against Homeland Security itself, and one TV ad morphed Cleland's face into Saddam Hussein's while suggesting that Cleland was indifferent to the safety of the American people.

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Max_Cleland


You don't see how morphing the face of a disabled U.S. Soldier who gave three limbs for his country and received the Silver Star for heroism in combat into the face of a murderous dictator is a dick move? I guess that doesn't surprise me coming from the President of the Swift Boat Vet's Fan Club. 


Yeah sure. Seeing your face morphed into the face of the United States' biggest enemy and the military leader of a country with whom America has already fought one war with wouldn't come across as a question of your patriotism at all. Really, what was Cleland thinking? Jeez, its obvious that by super-imposing the faces of Saddam Hussien and Max Cleland, Chambliss was simply evaluating Cleland's performance as the State Representative of Georgia. Yeah, that seems pretty clear from watching the ad.

   

The Chambliss ad, the one we are discussing, did not morph anyone's face into anyone else's. 


Because you are already aware that this is not what we are discussing, your question dishonestly assumes a fact not in play.  Your penchant for silly exaggeration doesn't make you more persuasive.


See above.

This is the Chambliss ad, exactly as I described it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKFYpd0q9nE

No morphing of faces.  No questioning of patriotism. 

No. I had to get a waiver due to a mitral valve prolapse with regurgitation. The surgeon general decided to deny my waiver. I believe I can try again at some point (a year?), but at the moment I'm back in college.
Feel free to give me the hook up if you know some people Imparied  :laugh:

Good luck to you, my friend!

OswaldTheOsprey

My wife has that condition. Bummer.

No, I was just a lowly SSgt. My connections could get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks (if you have $4) - keep trying is all I can offer.

Sorry to hear that. Joining the Navy was one if the most exciting things I did. I joined for one reason: to see the world. Boy, did it work. There's nothing like steaming into Hong Kong Harbor, or having dinner at Singapore's Raffel's Hotel in our white uniforms, or rescuing "boat people" from the South China Sea. Or living in Germany for two years--the military even shipped my car over for me.
I wonder if you could work for the Peace Corps? That would also be a great way to see far off lands...?

Thanks for your service. My dad was Navy in World War II.

OswaldTheOsprey

Then he saw more action in one day than I did in eight years of active service. For which I consider myself extremely fortunate.

True. However you were there if needed which is more than I ever did.

OswaldTheOsprey

Both the ad apparently you believe you are discussing, and the ad for which you provided the link, is the later "cleaned up" version of the ad after (rightful) outrage and disgust over the original by members of both parties in which Cleland's face is faded in frame with Saddam's.

In either ad, whether Cleland has his face actually faded in with Saddam's while the narrator questions Cleland's commitment to protecting American citizens or simply put on the same screen with Saddam's while the narrator questions his commitment to protecting American citizens is an inconsequential detail only a lawyer would try to parse.

Clearly flashing pictures of Osama bin Laden, Saddam Hussein, and Max Cleland (the only 3 human beings pictured in the ad) on the screen while misrepresenting Cleland's voting record to make it appear as if he was against the Department of Homeland Security is   nothing more than a disgusting example of dirty politics at its worst. It was designed to do nothing more than to misrepresent Cleland's votes in an effort to fan the fears of people as much as possible in the hopes of obtaining an emotional fear-based reactionary vote over a level-headed and intelligent one. For Republicans, it works everytime.  

    
In any case, I don't really care. You're one of the 0.0001% of Americans who really like these kinds of ad's. You're all about defending ad's that tear down our decorated Veterans and War Heros, and that question their loyalty, and question their commitment to defending America, and that makes fun of the injuries they sustained in combat, and compares them to terrorists. You love these ad's. You think they're real swell.

Fortunately, everyone else on the face of the planet, left or right, sees these kinds of ad's for exactly what they are - absolutely despicable nonsense crap. If you don't agree with the rest of the world in condemning these kinds of attacks on our Veterans, I certainly don't have any illusions about convincing you otherwise.

Your claim was that the Chambliss ad morphed Cleland's face into UBL's.  It didn't.  Demonstrating that with a link to the ad isn't an inconsequential detail; it is the core of your claim.


Clearly wrong.  Did you see the ad?

Here it is, again.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKFYpd0q9nE


Also wrong.  Cleland cast all 11 votes referenced in the ad.


I guess this is what a concession from you reads like.  Hyperbolic inaccuracy.

Neither Ryan nor Cleland approve of ads that criticise Cleland or reference his votes in the Senate.  The "How dare you question my patriotism?" protest is an unsubtle diversion.

You are absolutely right. The link you provided does not show Cleland's and Saddam's faces morphing together. The link you provided is the later revised version of the original ad to which I am referring. We are referrinng to two different ads. 




Since you quoted it, I would have to assume you read what I said. I never once said or suggested Cleland did not cast the votes in question. I said, as you cut-and-pasted above, Cleland's votes were "mispresented". Furthermore, I supported this fact with a complete explaination and supporting evidence with a link. But, as usual, you handpick the tiny handful of irrelevant, or at best, secondary points from a post that you can dispute and ignore or refuse to acknowledge any points that you are unable to refute which usually, and not coincidentally, make up the main argument of the post.

Since you refused to respond to my original argument that Cleland's 11 votes were mispresented in the ad, let's see if you will respond or tuck-tail this time:

FACT: The ad suggests Cleland did not favor the creation of the Department of Homeland Security. It does this by only stating he voted against various measures of it 11 times without providing the true context of those votes, and instead makes the false suggestion that Cleland cast these votes because he lacked courage. Another word for someone who lacks courage is coward. In fact, someone who lacks courage is the actual definition of the word "coward" (http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/thesaurus?book=Thesaurus&va=coward).

In summary, the message of the ad is that Cleland is a coward who cannot be trusted to take the steps necessary to protect American citizens from threats posed by individuals such as Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein. That is the message of the ad - to the letter.

The ad is false. The truth is, as demonstrated before, Cleland supported the creation of the Department of Homeland Security before Bush did, and was the con-sponsor of the original legislation that actually formed the Department of Homeland Security. The 11 votes presented in the ad had nothing to do with Cleland's support of the existence of the Department as whole. The votes in question pertained to civil service protections for employees of the Department of Homeland Security (which Bush opposed and Cleland supported) and these 11 votes were cast in an effort to gain better protections for the individuals actually working in the Department defending the country - certainly not because Cleland lacked "the courage to lead" as the ad shamefully suggests. The ad does not provide the appropriate context or information for the average viewer to infer anything other than Cleland is against the Department of Homeland Security - which is false.   

I don't really expect you to respond because there is no reasonable debate or question about whether the ad misrepresents Cleland's voting record on the Department of Homeland Security. It does. Period.


 

Wow...I knew I would catch you but not so soon.....

In the above post you claim to be a E-5...yet in the below post a SSGT....which is it soldier boy? How can you be a E-5 in one post then a day later a E-6?


http://www.itsallpolitics.com/component/option,com_smf/Itemid,26/action,profile/u,80/

For all of you that dont know, a E-5 is a Sgt.....a E-6 is a SSgt.....

SSgt meaning a Staff Sgt....

I knew you were a fake....but a liar too.....LOL

CAUGHT......toaster is another "phoney soldier".......LOL