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Title: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Patton on October 31, 2007, 05:10:21 AM Well...at least 2 of the things recommended to not speak of in polite company...
How does an Atheists intellectually deal with the religion of a Presidential candidate? It is known that some atheists say that purple unicorns exist as much as God exists... That in effect leaves an Atheist supporting a believer in purple unicorns, the tooth fairy and Santa Claus for President of the United States....must be comforting. Some atheists will enthusiatically endorse, support and contribute to the campaigns...place the candidates high on pedestals...how they are "good for the country"..all the while saving their vocal and written intolerance and vitriol against God and religion for us regular folks who can't change anything...and all the while praising their candidate...who very well could change things and the same atheists WILL NOT speak publically or loudly about their candidates faith in God. Intresting. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: bringbackwigs on October 31, 2007, 05:16:07 AM Well, I know atheists that refuse to look at a candidates' religion as a reason to vote/not vote for them. It stems from being so mad at the mega-Christians who vote in other mega-Christians only because they are mega-Christians.
Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Patton on October 31, 2007, 07:47:53 AM Well, I know atheists that refuse to look at a candidates' religion as a reason to vote/not vote for them. It stems from being so mad at the mega-Christians who vote in other mega-Christians only because they are mega-Christians. So, does it come down to a choice between generic religious/Christian-vs-mega Religious/mega Christian? BTW...how bout those Jayhawks? Whoda thunk it. Wanna make a friendly wager IF they meet OU for the Big 12? Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: bringbackwigs on October 31, 2007, 07:58:05 AM Pretty much.
And what do you mean "if?" When it happens, we will wager. And when we beat you down, go undefeated and play for the BCS title, you will cry. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Patton on October 31, 2007, 08:02:03 AM And what do you mean "if?" When it happens, we will wager. And when we beat you down, go undefeated and play for the BCS title, you will cry. Game on. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: allpoints on October 31, 2007, 08:33:39 AM That in effect leaves an Atheist supporting a believer in purple unicorns, the tooth fairy and Santa Claus for President of the United States....must be comforting.
I liked it better in the old days when you could keep the strength of your own convictions and still get elected President... "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise." -- James Madison "Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man." -- Thomas Jefferson "The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." -- John Adams "My earlier views of the unsoundness of the Christian scheme of salvation and the human origin of the scriptures have become clearer and stronger with advancing years, and I see no reason for thinking I shall ever change them." -- Abraham Lincoln "Every new and successful example, therefore, of a perfect separation between the ecclesiastical and civil matters, is of importance; and I have no doubt that every new example will succeed, as every past one has done, in showing that religion and Government will both exist in greater purity the less they are mixed together" -- James Madison "God is an essence that we know nothing of. Until this awful blasphemy is got rid of, there never will be any liberal science in the world." -- John Adams "History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes" -- Thomas Jefferson It is known that some atheists say that purple unicorns exist as much as God exists... Your theology is incorrect. Atheists say there's an equal chance of the occurance of an invisible pink unicorn and god, using illogical theist methods of proof. Quote Cousteau asked Andersen: "Nice day outside isn't it." Andersen replied: "Yes, except for the fact that I forgot my glasses." Cousteau remarked: "God works in mysterious ways." Perturbed by the comment, Andersen moved to another table. Cousteau followed. Andersen didn't make eye contact when he spoke: "Excuse me sir, but I would like to enjoy my coffee alone. I'm trying to think right now." Cousteau remained undeterred: "Are you trying to say that you don't believe in God?" "I believe in what I can see," said Andersen firmly. "So today, do you believe in nothing?" Cousteau said, and grinned at the wit of his own pot-shot. "Then I believe in what I can prove," said Andersen. "But do you not believe in what you cannot prove?" returned Cousteau. "I don't follow." said Andersen, who actually started to listen. "If I told you there was an Invisible Pink Unicorn outside grazing on the lawn right now, what would you say?" asked Cousteau. "I'd say you're guano loco." "But you can't 'prove' that there isn't, right?" "Why would I need to?" "Nevermind need. Could you?" "What purpose would there be in proving either way?" "Must everything be done for a purpose?" "Yes. That's where the word why comes from." "Nevermind why. But I'll assume that you couldn't prove that there isn't an invisible pink unicorn grazing outside right now." "If I could see the grass clearly, which I cannot, I would prove that there isn't by the lack of evidence. There are no hoof-prints, there is no grass being consumed, and there is no dung out on the lawn right now. The only dung I see is this theory of yours." "Actually, I just thought it up right now, but I should write it down and publish it as theory. Thank you Sir!" said Cousteau, and ran off into the sunset. The Invisible Pink Unicorn was created by Cousteau that day in order to defend the existence of God by illogical proof. http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/IPU Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: illy on October 31, 2007, 10:28:04 AM Well, I'm not necessarily an athiest, but I don't tend to vote on candidates who want to make a big deal out of religion. Affiliation with the Falwell and Robertson types is a strike against them.
I don't mind if a candidate follows a faith, or believes things I think they have no proof to believe. They are entitled to their own personal views of things. Religious doctrine and dogma should be kept entirely out of policy. I won't vote for someone based on their religion or lack thereof, and TBH, candidates talking about their religion are as relevant to poliotics as when Bill Clinton was playing his sax. Candidates who announce they intend to institute policy based on religion tend not to get my vote. I don't care what their faith is so long as they keep it out of policy. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: IamMe on October 31, 2007, 12:22:09 PM Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: OswaldTheOsprey on October 31, 2007, 01:07:25 PM I would vote for a candidate whose political policies I liked but whose religious views I disliked over one whose politics I disliked and religious views I liked. For example, Romney's Mormonism means nothing to me one way or another.
OswaldTheOsprey Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Gojira on October 31, 2007, 01:21:39 PM This uncyclopedia thing is great! lol. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Callum on October 31, 2007, 01:28:41 PM There are times when I thank my back-story for the fact that I am not asked to chose which narrow politico from a choice of visionless nonentities should have a disproprtionate influence on the way the world develops for the next two and a half years.
There are times when I hate my back-story for the fact that I am not asked to chose which narrow politico from a choice of visionless nonentities should have a disproprtionate influence on the way the world develops for the next two and a half years. Those of us who try to make our lives in the world simply and for the good of our families, friends, nation and species find the sad procession of dull, uncompassionate, sometimes passionate self-serving, pop-serving, gutless, inward-looking, hamfisted, shallow, ordinary politicians to be almost the proof that there is no god. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: IamMe on October 31, 2007, 01:44:39 PM I'm not old enough to vote yet (I should be able to vote on our new EU Enabling Act next year though) but I wouldn't vote based on a candidate's religion unless their religion meant they did things I didn't agree with. For example, our PM recently said that secularists had no place in Irish society - therefore I will not vote for him.
Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: allpoints on October 31, 2007, 01:49:00 PM Irony intended. ;D Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Delta Nine on October 31, 2007, 01:52:05 PM I would vote for a candidate whose political policies I liked but whose religious views I disliked over one whose politics I disliked and religious views I liked. For example, Romney's Mormonism means nothing to me one way or another. OswaldTheOsprey So you think its ok that he believes a story that is obviously false. A two year old with an internet connection can figure out that Joe Smith was a fraud. I expect the president of the USA to know that. Would it be ok with you if he believed the easter bunny was real? Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: IamMe on October 31, 2007, 01:57:14 PM Irony intended. ;D What do you mean? Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Findeton on October 31, 2007, 03:03:52 PM I would vote for a candidate whose political policies I liked but whose religious views I disliked over one whose politics I disliked and religious views I liked. For example, Romney's Mormonism means nothing to me one way or another. OswaldTheOsprey So you think its ok that he believes a story that is obviously false. A two year old with an internet connection can figure out that Joe Smith was a fraud. I expect the president of the USA to know that. Would it be ok with you if he believed the easter bunny was real? Yes, as long as that belief doesn't affect her judgement. I'm spanish, an atheist, and our president is Jose Luis RodrÃguez Zapatero, and he has stated that he is christian. Well, he is christian and i'm atheist, so what? shouldn't i vote for him? I would vote any candidate whose values are acceptable, and i don't care if he's got those values from christianity or atheism or pastafarism or rastafarism, or from the islam. I want a president to be secular, not to mix the government with any religion, i demand him to get the subject of religion out of the schools, i don't want any reference of god in any official statement. If a certain candidate supports that, well, i don't fuckin' care if he is muslim, christian or what. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: allpoints on October 31, 2007, 03:15:01 PM Irony intended. ;D What do you mean? The irony of using an uncyclopedia link to illustrate a misquoted absurdity based on a logical fallacy used to defend a myth. I guess it's my own little private gigglefest... Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: OswaldTheOsprey on October 31, 2007, 06:52:46 PM I would vote for a candidate whose political policies I liked but whose religious views I disliked over one whose politics I disliked and religious views I liked. For example, Romney's Mormonism means nothing to me one way or another. OswaldTheOsprey So you think its ok that he believes a story that is obviously false. A two year old with an internet connection can figure out that Joe Smith was a fraud. I expect the president of the USA to know that. Would it be ok with you if he believed the easter bunny was real? Again, I am interested in their positions on political issues-nothing more. Suppose you believed in everyone of his secular political policies. Would you still reject him exclusively on religious grounds? OswaldTheOsprey Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Delta Nine on November 01, 2007, 04:42:22 AM I would vote for a candidate whose political policies I liked but whose religious views I disliked over one whose politics I disliked and religious views I liked. For example, Romney's Mormonism means nothing to me one way or another. OswaldTheOsprey So you think its ok that he believes a story that is obviously false. A two year old with an internet connection can figure out that Joe Smith was a fraud. I expect the president of the USA to know that. Would it be ok with you if he believed the easter bunny was real? Again, I am interested in their positions on political issues-nothing more. Suppose you believed in everyone of his secular political policies. Would you still reject him exclusively on religious grounds? OswaldTheOsprey Yes. If you're dumb enough to be a Mormon you sure as hell not smart enough to be president. Decision should be made on logic, reason and science, not faith in sky friends. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Factinista on November 01, 2007, 06:55:14 AM Patton is confusing the difference between candidates that are religious, and candidates that have religious policies.
First off it is nearly impossible for a candidate to be "officially" anything but a Christian in modern politics. How many non-Christians are running for office now? 1, a deist(Gravel). For whatever reason being a Christian is essentially a test of a candidates "Americanity". This is because of the illusion that many Americans hold of our country. America is NOT founded on Christianity, but many believe it is. So the real question is whether or not their policies infringe on the religion (or lackthereof) of citizens. Clinton for example used very little of his religious belief to change policies despite his rhetoric about faith. However Bush openly and honestly tells us that religion controls what he does in office, as well as supporting faith based initiatives. This is how we "Atheists" look at candidates. We, like all Americans, pick the best choice we can based upon the myriad of corrupt politicians whos real intentions are always hidden. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Patton on November 01, 2007, 08:28:25 AM Patton is confusing the difference between candidates that are religious, and candidates that have religious policies. I am not confused. I mentioned nothing of their policies. How does an Atheists intellectually deal with the religion of a Presidential candidate? Basically an atheists MUST support, in MOST ALL cases a Christian, to run the country. As demonstrated repeatedly on this forum...the contempt, vitriol, sense of superiority and in some cases outright hatred that some atheists direct toward Christians, I find it intresting those same people will go to GREAT lenghths to defend these "demented"..."stupid"..."unintelligent" individuals....I attemted to describe this earlier: Some atheists will enthusiatically endorse, support and contribute to the campaigns...place the candidates high on pedestals...how they are "good for the country"..all the while saving their vocal and written intolerance and vitriol against God and religion for us regular folks who can't change anything...and all the while praising their candidate...who very well could change things and the same atheists WILL NOT speak publically or loudly about their candidates faith in God. Quote First off it is nearly impossible for a candidate to be "officially" anything but a Christian in modern politics. How many non-Christians are running for office now? 1, a deist(Gravel). For whatever reason being a Christian is essentially a test of a candidates "Americanity". This is because of the illusion that many Americans hold of our country. America is NOT founded on Christianity, but many believe it is. So...I guess this country is run by and supported by a bunch of idiots. Quote We, like all Americans, pick the best choice we can based upon the myriad of corrupt politicians whos real intentions are always hidden. You will get no arguement from me here. Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: OswaldTheOsprey on November 01, 2007, 08:46:42 AM I would vote for a candidate whose political policies I liked but whose religious views I disliked over one whose politics I disliked and religious views I liked. For example, Romney's Mormonism means nothing to me one way or another. OswaldTheOsprey So you think its ok that he believes a story that is obviously false. A two year old with an internet connection can figure out that Joe Smith was a fraud. I expect the president of the USA to know that. Would it be ok with you if he believed the easter bunny was real? Again, I am interested in their positions on political issues-nothing more. Suppose you believed in everyone of his secular political policies. Would you still reject him exclusively on religious grounds? OswaldTheOsprey Yes. If you're dumb enough to be a Mormon you sure as hell not smart enough to be president. Decision should be made on logic, reason and science, not faith in sky friends. To each their own. OswaldTheOsprey Title: Re: Atheism, Religion, and Politics.... Post by: Dormouse on November 01, 2007, 11:36:03 AM Well...at least 2 of the things recommended to not speak of in polite company... Wow. How does an Atheists intellectually deal with the religion of a Presidential candidate? It is known that some atheists say that purple unicorns exist as much as God exists... That in effect leaves an Atheist supporting a believer in purple unicorns, the tooth fairy and Santa Claus for President of the United States....must be comforting. Some atheists will enthusiatically endorse, support and contribute to the campaigns...place the candidates high on pedestals...how they are "good for the country"..all the while saving their vocal and written intolerance and vitriol against God and religion for us regular folks who can't change anything...and all the while praising their candidate...who very well could change things and the same atheists WILL NOT speak publically or loudly about their candidates faith in God. Intresting. It never ceases to amaze me the lengths that Christians will go to pretend they are some kind of oppressed minority in the USA or amongst its government. Atheists are simply forced to 'suck it up and take it on the chin' on this issue on a daily basis. And you complain that you don't like it? Btw, the power of religious institutions is entirely dependent upon average religious people far more than an President or politician. Politicians don't usually have any scope at all to exercise any effect on relgion. Average people do. And as far as I can see in US politics, atheists aren't much of concern to any one for anything. They are dismissed as a tiny minority and not a single elected federal politician claims atheism. Christians, who are at least the largest plurality if not an outright majority in the USA have been quite active in trying to advance a Christian agenda in politics over the last 20 years. And they are offended that atheists don't like it? I don't get it.
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