gomper7
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« Reply #60 on: November 07, 2007, 02:53:20 AM » |
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What I got from his posts was that he didn't necessarily believe that selling ARM's qualified as predatory. That, and that buyers should beware. Meaning informed.
Yeah, they should be informed. But as Gompers himself proves, people often are not. Biker is of course correct, we all can agree there ARE predatory and unscupulous lenders out there who should be punished. I never said otherwise. What I belive is just a figment of your fevered imagination is that the predatory lenders are what caused the current crisses in the mortgage industry. That and this silly idea you seem to have that all ARMs are an example of predatory lending. I hope I am actually uninformed and mistaken about that, and that you do not actually believe that ALL ARM's are predatory practices that should be regulated out of existence. Because otherwise, your last statement is correct, and I have proven that people are often not informed, although in such a case I would simply state that it was never my intent to prove you so woefully uninformed, it just sort of worked out that way. |
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Biker Dude
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« Reply #61 on: November 07, 2007, 05:27:03 AM » |
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Biker is of course correct, we all can agree there ARE predatory and unscupulous lenders out there who should be punished. I never said otherwise. What I belive is just a figment of your fevered imagination is that the predatory lenders are what caused the current crisses in the mortgage industry. That and this silly idea you seem to have that all ARMs are an example of predatory lending. I hope I am actually uninformed and mistaken about that, and that you do not actually believe that ALL ARM's are predatory practices that should be regulated out of existence. Because otherwise, your last statement is correct, and I have proven that people are often not informed, although in such a case I would simply state that it was never my intent to prove you so woefully uninformed, it just sort of worked out that way.
See? Now THAT is what I got from his posts. Almost verbatim what I would have said. And I don't think it is that difficult to suss out. Are you trying to be obtuse jpn? |
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 Who will watch the watchers?Now that it is over, what are we going to talk about? |
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jpn of Seattle
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« Reply #62 on: November 08, 2007, 08:42:28 PM » |
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Biker is of course correct, we all can agree there ARE predatory and unscupulous lenders out there who should be punished. I never said otherwise. What I belive is just a figment of your fevered imagination is that the predatory lenders are what caused the current crisses in the mortgage industry. So Gomper, you agree that there are predatory lenders, but you are claiming that they didn't have anything to do with the current crisis in the mortgage industry. So they are irrelevant to this discussion. Is that right? That and this silly idea you seem to have that all ARMs are an example of predatory lending. I hope I am actually uninformed and mistaken about that, and that you do not actually believe that ALL ARM's are predatory practices that should be regulated out of existence. Because otherwise, your last statement is correct, and I have proven that people are often not informed, although in such a case I would simply state that it was never my intent to prove you so woefully uninformed, it just sort of worked out that way. No, not all ARMs are predatory practices. As long as the lender makes the terms of the loan clear, then they aren't necessarily nefarious. But for those who do engage in predatory loan practices, the ARM is one of their favorite and most lucrative vehicles. |
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What you got is everything-and I mean everything—run by the political arm. It’s the reign of the Mayberry Machiavellis. --John DiIulio, former White House official
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Biker Dude
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« Reply #63 on: November 08, 2007, 09:59:03 PM » |
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Didn't have ANYTHING to do with it? Oh I am sure they are in there. I think far more to blame are the mortgage lender that wrote tons of loans to people with shady credit. 100% loans. Then I would look at the people packaging up these mortgages to sell to investment bankers. Then I would look at the rating companies that somehow decided these packages should be rated AAA. I would lay blame in all those places before I went after a mortgage lender selling ARM's.
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Who will watch the watchers?Now that it is over, what are we going to talk about?
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jpn of Seattle
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« Reply #64 on: November 08, 2007, 10:14:31 PM » |
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Okay, so we've gone from:
"First off, you like to throw accusations of predatory lending around, but you do not even show one example"
to,
"Biker is of course correct, we all can agree there ARE predatory and unscupulous lenders out there who should be punished. I never said otherwise. What I belive is just a figment of your fevered imagination is that the predatory lenders are what caused the current crisses in the mortgage industry."
to,
"Didn't have ANYTHING to do with it? Oh I am sure they are in there."
It's been quite a journey.
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What you got is everything-and I mean everything—run by the political arm. It’s the reign of the Mayberry Machiavellis. --John DiIulio, former White House official
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Biker Dude
A TRUE Liberal!
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Karma: +156/-117
Posts: 2,103
Live to Ride, Ride to Live
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« Reply #65 on: November 08, 2007, 10:18:18 PM » |
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Okay, so we've gone from:
"First off, you like to throw accusations of predatory lending around, but you do not even show one example"
to,
"Biker is of course correct, we all can agree there ARE predatory and unscupulous lenders out there who should be punished. I never said otherwise. What I belive is just a figment of your fevered imagination is that the predatory lenders are what caused the current crisses in the mortgage industry."
to,
"Didn't have ANYTHING to do with it? Oh I am sure they are in there."
It's been quite a journey.
If you care about honesty, you and I both know that the last one was mine. And we both know I did not say the first one. So your little 'journey timeline' is a little skewed by dishonesty. |
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Who will watch the watchers?Now that it is over, what are we going to talk about?
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gomper7
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Karma: +28/-10
Posts: 238
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« Reply #66 on: November 08, 2007, 11:23:47 PM » |
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Drama much?
jpn, I simply did not let you get away with sweeping generalizations about predatory lending without a single link, that is what I meant by my first challenge. Of course, you dramatacized that into "gomper thinks predatory lending is just a figment..." you know the rest, you wrote it. And then you provided links to some stories about predatory lending. Thanks by the way. Of course, from what I read, your links do not tend to indicate that it was these instances of predatory lending that caused the current mortgage crisis. So I said, of course there exists predatory lending, but I do not believe it caused the current crises. Once again, you dramatize that into "oh, so you think they had nothing to do with the crisis". I say "did not cause", you interpret as "have nothing to do with". Of course there are predators in the mortgage industry, as with any industry, and I have no doubt there are many loans that could be considered predatory in the ever growing list of foreclosures. I also believe, however, that even if you removed loans that I would consider predatory, you would still be seeing this vast increase in foreclosures. People simply borrowed more than they could afford hoping the house values would continue to rise which did not happen.
And, you are correct, this has been quite a journey, but I have faith that if you will drop the dramatics and apply some logic, you may still catch up with those of us in reality.
I would agree with your assessment that any loan in which the lender does not upfront provide the repayment terms to the borrower would be predatory. Here is where I disagree with your original post however: There are already prosecutable regulations against this sort of practice, and I do not believe that the predatory loans caused the current crises (ie, take them out of the equation and you still have a crisis). So, I disagree that the current crisis and the predatory loans are automatic proof we need more regulation.
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« Last Edit: November 09, 2007, 12:42:48 AM by gomper7 »
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jpn of Seattle
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« Reply #67 on: November 09, 2007, 09:50:23 PM » |
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zzzzzzzzzzz  |
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What you got is everything-and I mean everything—run by the political arm. It’s the reign of the Mayberry Machiavellis. --John DiIulio, former White House official
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gomper7
Full Member
Karma: +28/-10
Posts: 238
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« Reply #68 on: November 09, 2007, 10:09:38 PM » |
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Oh,
you have been sleeping through this whole thing. Well, that would explain why your rants here have been irrational and off point.
Now I get it.
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5uperChicken
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« Reply #69 on: November 10, 2007, 05:02:17 AM » |
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Regulation???
You realize, there are private accreditation services that will help you not look like an idiot at some point down the road...Regulation??? I thought you people were pro-choice....wise-up & get with the program.
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gomper7
Full Member
Karma: +28/-10
Posts: 238
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« Reply #70 on: November 13, 2007, 07:58:44 AM » |
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Oh,
you have been sleeping through this whole thing. Well, that would explain why your rants here have been irrational and off point.
Now I get it. My "rants"? Is that how you characterize posts that disagree with yours? yes, but only when they do so in a ranting fashion. |
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jpn of Seattle
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« Reply #71 on: November 30, 2007, 08:05:40 AM » |
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Another example of government regulation being a good thing: November 30, 2007, 7:10 am America loses the wireless race — againI have a T-Mobile cell phone, which uses GSM technology; it works all over the world — and in parts of New Jersey. One of the parts of New Jersey where it doesn’t work happens to be my own home. As a result, I’ve been acutely aware of the price America paid for not doing what Europe did, and settling on a single mobile standard. But defenders of the American non-system argued that it would pay off in the long run, by spurring competition that would lead to faster technological progress. Never mind. From John Gapper: I am afraid that history has not been kind to this argument. Europe has stayed ahead of the US in mobile telephony, and in 3G services. Having one technology standard has spurred competition among network operators and handset manufacturers while competition in the US has been stymied by a proliferation of technologies. Europe is also pulling ahead on broadband, again because of judicious regulation. There’s a lesson in here somewhere. |
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What you got is everything-and I mean everything—run by the political arm. It’s the reign of the Mayberry Machiavellis. --John DiIulio, former White House official
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Abraxas
Global Moderator
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"You do not speak for the rest"
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« Reply #72 on: November 30, 2007, 08:10:37 AM » |
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LOL! You linked a blog by a personal person and pass it off as reputable? How low will you go? At least private companies don't let as many BOMBS on planesMost fake bombs missed by screeners
75% not detected at LAX; 60% at O'Hare
WASHINGTON — Security screeners at two of the nation's busiest airports failed to find fake bombs hidden on undercover agents posing as passengers in more than 60% of tests last year, according to a classified report obtained by USA TODAY.
Screeners at Los Angeles International Airport missed about 75% of simulated explosives and bomb parts that Transportation Security Administration testers hid under their clothes or in carry-on bags at checkpoints, the TSA report shows.
At Chicago O'Hare International Airport, screeners missed about 60% of hidden bomb materials that were packed in everyday carry-ons — including toiletry kits, briefcases and CD players. San Francisco International Airport screeners, who work for a private company instead of the TSA, missed about 20% of the bombs, the report shows. The TSA ran about 70 tests at Los Angeles, 75 at Chicago and 145 at San Francisco.
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A report on covert tests in 2002 found screeners failed to find fake bombs, dynamite and guns 24% of the time. The TSA ran those tests shortly after it took over checkpoint screening from security companies.
Tests earlier in 2002 showed screeners missing 60% of fake bombs. In the late 1990s, tests showed that screeners missed about 40% of fake bombs, according to a separate report by the Government Accountability Office, the investigative arm of Congress.
The recent TSA report says San Francisco screeners face constant covert tests and are "more suspicious." |
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
- Noam Chomsky
... you can almost see the high water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
- Hunter S. Thompson
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