Midland
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« on: December 26, 2007, 02:45:16 PM » |
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Caution: Will China become another Nazi Germany?-A Comparison for discussion
China:
Rising power, large population and army force
Extreme ideologies(communism, nationalism, socialism, revanchism)
A nation greatly hurt in the past(suffering foreign oppression since 1840, WW2, Korean War), strong hatred of foreign countries(Japan, US etc.) and strong desire to seek vengeance
Extreme hatred against a particular nation (the Japanese)
A totalitarian governing body(CPC)
Army & Party incorporated(PLA) (The army fights for the party, instead of the country)
Great military capability, and nuclear weapon
Nazi Germany:
Had been a rising power, large population and tremendous army
Extreme ideologies(National socialism(Nazism), nationalism, exclusionism, anti-semitism)
A nation hurt after WW1(Versailles Treaty), strong hatred of foreign countries, and strong desire to seek vengeance
Extreme hatred against a particular nation(the Jews)
A totalitarian governing body (the Nazi Party)
Army & Party incorporated(SS etc.) (The army fights for the party, instead of the country)
Great military capability, no nuclear weapon
PEOPLE OF THE WORLD, BE AND STAY CAUTIOUS!
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Abraxas
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« Reply #1 on: December 26, 2007, 02:50:41 PM » |
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No.
Cause Nazi Germany steadely got worse with time, but China is approaching it's economy in a more capatilistic way... and they'll have to keep laborers happy so they can keep consumers happy. As a result, the government will have to change and allow greater involvement of the people... or their economy will collapse.
China also needs open borders, and therefor has people watching them all the time, because they're greatest market is the cheap shit they send us. Nazi Germany was not like this.
Nazi Germany is not China.
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
- Noam Chomsky
... you can almost see the high water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Midland
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« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2007, 03:20:48 PM » |
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It seems you don't know much about China, who are the major consumers in China? And what is the major ingredient of China's GDP? Frankly speaking, 10% of China's population account for 90% of China's consumption, and 50% of the population are struggling for a living; and China's GDP rise is mostly the result of appalling corruption consumptions...
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gex
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« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2007, 04:50:57 PM » |
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China also doesn't have a group within the country they can lay blame on if something bad happens since it is a homogenus country.
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OswaldTheOsprey
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« Reply #4 on: December 26, 2007, 05:24:16 PM » |
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It seems you don't know much about China, who are the major consumers in China? And what is the major ingredient of China's GDP? Frankly speaking, 10% of China's population account for 90% of China's consumption, and 50% of the population are struggling for a living; and China's GDP rise is mostly the result of appalling corruption consumptions...
Sounds more like France in 1789 or Russia in 1917 than Nazi Germany, IMHO. OswaldTheOsprey |
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Urbi et Orbi
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Abraxas
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« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2007, 05:27:28 PM » |
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It seems you don't know much about China On the contrary. Your implications and conclusions are either tragically misinformed or intentionally misrepresented. ... who are the major consumers in China? In China? What do you mean? And what is the major ingredient of China's GDP? Looks like industry to me. GDP - composition by sector:
agriculture: 11.7%
industry: 48.9%
services: 39.3%
note: industry includes construction (2006 est.) LINKFrankly speaking, 10% of China's population account for 90% of China's consumption, and 50% of the population are struggling for a living... Actually, their wealth distriution at the highest and lowest 10th percentile looks a lot like ours. Household income or consumption by percentage share:
lowest 10%: 1.6%
highest 10%: 34.9% (2004) LINKHousehold income or consumption by percentage share:
lowest 10%: 1.9%
highest 10%: 29.9% (2000) LINKand China's GDP rise is mostly the result of appalling corruption consumptions... Actually, it's because of a massive move toward a more free market. China's economy during the last quarter century has changed from a centrally planned system that was largely closed to international trade to a more market-oriented economy that has a rapidly growing private sector and is a major player in the global economy. Reforms started in the late 1970s with the phasing out of collectivized agriculture, and expanded to include the gradual liberalization of prices, fiscal decentralization, increased autonomy for state enterprises, the foundation of a diversified banking system, the development of stock markets, the rapid growth of the non-state sector, and the opening to foreign trade and investment. China has generally implemented reforms in a gradualist or piecemeal fashion, including the sale of equity in China's largest state banks to foreign investors and refinements in foreign exchange and bond markets in 2005. The restructuring of the economy and resulting efficiency gains have contributed to a more than tenfold increase in GDP since 1978. LINK |
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« Last Edit: December 26, 2007, 05:30:15 PM by Abraxas »
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
- Noam Chomsky
... you can almost see the high water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Midland
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« Reply #6 on: December 26, 2007, 05:46:03 PM » |
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Do you really believe China has a "free" market? I think it's bureaucratically controlled...hawhaw
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Midland
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« Reply #7 on: December 26, 2007, 05:54:20 PM » |
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How could it be possible that more than 30% of the population can enter the rank of highest 10%? I don't know where "CIA Fact Book" got the data, but the fact is, as most Chinese people agree, the society is drastically divided into two classes, the privileged and the underprivileged, the slaves and the slave-owners, according to the estimation of a renowned Chinese professor, the actual circumstance is that 5% of the population possess 95% of social wealth, among which are mostly bureaucrats and estate developers-the so-called new privileged class in China, and as a result, many average people live as slaves...
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Retro Fit
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« Reply #8 on: December 26, 2007, 06:07:27 PM » |
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There is no comparison. China is going to get what she wants without firing a shot. She is striking at the soft financial under belly of her enemies and will take control by way of her enemies own fiscal irresponsibility.
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Abraxas
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"You do not speak for the rest"
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« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2007, 06:29:54 PM » |
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Do you really believe China has a "free" market? I think it's bureaucratically controlled...hawhaw Well, what you think is entirely up to you, but the information I have given you from an (as far as I know) impeachable source says otherwise. With that said, China is still a huge threat, but not for any of the reasons YOU mentioned. In fact, they're a threat because they're NOT Nazi Germany. Our imports rely heavily on the Chinese and our consumer goods are kept cheap because of our trade agreements. Nazi Germany could only WISH to have been in a similar situation in WW 2 because they may have actually won... I think close to 15% of our debt is controlled by China. What happens when they pull it? What happens when they start taking the oil exports of other countries? What happens when American companies rely on the good graces of the Chinese to stay afloat? China represents NO conventional threat to America and anyone who thinks so needs to take a better look at the world and warfare in general. China represents an EMMENSE economic threat to the US and they need to be taken VERY seriously. You, on the other hand, do not. How could it be possible that more than 30% of the population can enter the rank of highest 10%? I don't know where "CIA Fact Book" got the data... Uhhhhh... first guess: The CIA... but the fact is, as most Chinese people agree, the society is drastically divided into two classes, the privileged and the underprivileged, the slaves and the slave-owners, according to the estimation of a renowned Chinese professor, the actual circumstance is that 5% of the population possess 95% of social wealth, among which are mostly bureaucrats and estate developers-the so-called new privileged class in China, and as a result, many average people live as slaves... You gonna source any of that? And as I have already proven, the upper 10th percentile controls 35% of the economy while the lowest control almost 2%. The US is not very different with 30% of the economy being controlled by the upper 10th percentile and 2% going to the lowest. Basically, their IS NO vast descrepency in wealth and you are flat out wrong. |
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
- Noam Chomsky
... you can almost see the high water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
- Hunter S. Thompson
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Abraxas
Global Moderator
Hero Member
Karma: +212/-207
Posts: 4,065
"You do not speak for the rest"
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« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2007, 12:01:23 AM » |
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I didn't lock this but I intend to find out who did and why...
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
- Noam Chomsky
... you can almost see the high water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
- Hunter S. Thompson
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jpn of Seattle
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« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2007, 07:33:08 PM » |
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Entirely bogus comparison, IMHO. The Nazi hatred of Jews came out of a long European tradition of blaming Jews for all things evil. Germany, especially Prussia, had a log tradition of militarism, unlike anything that I'm aware of in China. Germany had just suffered an excruciating loss in WWI followed by massive economic upheaval. In contrast, China's economic performance has been spectacular.
I think that what happened to Germany could happen to any nation that suffers extremely and suddenly a "savior" comes along with great charisma and all the answers (including who to blame for their misfortunes).
The potential to follow evil lies in all of us, and the awareness of this is our chief defense against it.
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« Last Edit: December 27, 2007, 07:39:37 PM by jpn of Seattle »
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What you got is everything-and I mean everything—run by the political arm. It’s the reign of the Mayberry Machiavellis. --John DiIulio, former White House official
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jpn of Seattle
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« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2007, 07:45:15 PM » |
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China shouldn't be made to be the great boogey-man of the future, unless facts suggest they fit the role. They are the logical successor to America as the most powerful nation on Earth, but probably not in my lifetime. Their problems are huge--massive poverty, massive population pressures, massive environmental problems, extreme ethnic divides including Moslums in their western provinces who want to secede.
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What you got is everything-and I mean everything—run by the political arm. It’s the reign of the Mayberry Machiavellis. --John DiIulio, former White House official
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Patton
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« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2007, 06:07:58 AM » |
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Part of Hitlers early popularity had to do with "righting the wrong" that befell Germany after WWI.....France and Britain levelled such constrictive and punitive penalties that ensured Germany would never rise to be a major player on the world stage...Hitler sought to change all that....and did.
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Battle is the most magnificent competition in which a human being can indulge. It brings out all that is best; it removes all that is base. All men are afraid in battle. The coward is the one who lets his fear overcome his sense of duty. Duty is the essence of manhood
-George S. Patton
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FreeinTX
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« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2007, 10:15:05 AM » |
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Entirely bogus comparison, IMHO. The Nazi hatred of Jews came out of a long European tradition of blaming Jews for all things evil. Germany, especially Prussia, had a log tradition of militarism, unlike anything that I'm aware of in China. Germany had just suffered an excruciating loss in WWI followed by massive economic upheaval. In contrast, China's economic performance has been spectacular.
I think that what happened to Germany could happen to any nation that suffers extremely and suddenly a "savior" comes along with great charisma and all the answers (including who to blame for their misfortunes).
The potential to follow evil lies in all of us, and the awareness of this is our chief defense against it.
Well said. There is no need to worry about China becoming another Germany. It's far more likele that the United States will produce a HITLERY and give rise to a CORPORATIST fascisct state mirroring a NAZI GERMANY. A government like ours, that has hired for advisers to the Department of Homeland Security, former KGB and former STAZI intelligence agents and their off-spring. As for China, they have no such values. They are truely GODLESS people who consider their 1 BILLION MASSIVE MAJORITY, the country's minority and show NO CONCERN WHATSOEVER about their welfare. You people in this forum talking about China's capitalistic markets and a burgeoning freindly economy, are simply DELUSIONAL!!!! I, myself, am CONSTANTLY talking about, and posting links to the human rights abuses at the hands of the Chinese. Forced abortions. Forced Sterilizations. Human organ harvesting. TORTURE AND MURDER of people who practise certain religions. One child policies. The methods, means, and apperatus used to go into a villiage and convert it into into slave labor camps where the people are FORCED to work in the most rediculous conditions to make products for export to America. What kind of profit is worth, the increased DEPENDANCE of the United States on cheap Chineese goods and products. Products made by slaves of a MURDEROUS, TORTUROUS, COMMUNIST, DICTATORSHIP REGIEM who we are now in debt to at a total of over $1.3 TRILLION. And from whom we are borrowing more and more from every day to fund a ILLEGAL and IMMORAL WAR AGINST THE IRAQI. For how long will you continue to insist that military might is the ONLY way to wage war? When will you recognize that interdependace on a REGIEM that murders, and tortures, and harvests the organs of, it's own people, might just be a negative for the entire country. And that NO PROFIT justifies this existent interdependance on China? The media talks about our dependance on oil. What about or dependance on FOOD? Depending on the season 25% from China!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvuhFSJXfZgVery explict graphics of violence, warning!!! FreeinTX |
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