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Author Topic: Monotheism and Polytheism both such silly concepts  (Read 1124 times)
Callum
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« Reply #45 on: February 14, 2008, 01:06:33 AM »

BTW  can we also have some explanation of why it is only christians who have this particular thing, which you are going to describe?


I never said only Christians....everyone does....it is just some refuse to use it for a host of reasons....

What I am taking issue with is the idea behind the 'refuse to use' phrase.  You appear to be saying that there is some act of volition in using this 'sense' you postulate.  Yet in NORMAL action all our other senses are not consciously 'used'.  You sem to endorse this view by referring to the God-sense as being like a receiver.  I realise that your wording implying volition is aimed at disparaging atheists and other boogeymen who 'deny God', but by doing so you invite questions about spirtual relativity - why do muslims and buddhists and jews all 'tune in' to different stations?  Why do primitive peoples 'refuse to use' their receivers?

A description, characterisation, set of observations of the God-sense would obviously help to clear up these questions....  but you haven't yet provided any.  I presume that you take the RF point of view 'its self-evident, so why shoud I investigate it'?

BTW where is RF?  Did my final challenges blow him away? Is he pining for barney? Or is he with the happy-backslappy crew on CARM on NPB?

BTW2  I don't agree that the likes of baldar or even JIMP and zuk should be banned permanently.  They may all be irritatingly self-opiniated (aren't we all?) and in some cases abusive and evil... but that is a facet of human nature that exists and should be represented here.
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Patton
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« Reply #46 on: February 14, 2008, 09:23:40 AM »

Quote
It is relevant....because it is roughly the same pattern for anything else you love...there is no "specific" brain wave for the love of Mom...it looks like love for Dad...love for sister...love for a friend and love for jelly donuts.


First off this is incorrect, the emotional response is different for each of these. The chemicals and electronic impulses are also recognizably different for each.

There is no specific brain wave for the love of mom but there IS a specific brain function for it. Brain function is a combination of chemical and electrical signals with cognitive behavior...

OK, I'll call.

Link your source for this information.....I'd be intrested to see it.
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IamMe
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« Reply #47 on: February 14, 2008, 03:00:15 PM »

That's not what's relevant. What's relevant is reaction to mother vs. reaction to stranger.

It is relevant....because it is roughly the same pattern for anything else you love...there is no "specific" brain wave for the love of Mom...it looks like love for Dad...love for sister...love for a friend and love for jelly donuts.

But different from hate, I presume.
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Factinista
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« Reply #48 on: February 14, 2008, 04:35:23 PM »

My statement is simply that the feelings we experience label as love can be understood through studying the inner working of the brain. If you really want to know why I believe this I could send you my psychology textbook...

Furthermore the original analogy you drew, you cannot prove 'love' so you cannot 'disprove' God, is a false analogy. The proper analogy, and response is.  You can prove whether or not someone experiences love and you can prove whether or not someone has had a religious experience. In fact scientists have been able to measure and reproduce religious experiences with magnetic impulses. (links will follow)




As always, understanding how the sun works does not make the sunrise any less beautiful.
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Patton
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« Reply #49 on: February 15, 2008, 10:14:17 AM »

My statement is simply that the feelings we experience label as love can be understood through studying the inner working of the brain. If you really want to know why I believe this I could send you my psychology textbook...

What you commented on: The chemicals and electronic impulses are also recognizably different for each. has nothing to do with Psychology...your comment is based on physical evidence...and since I was discussing a scan used to evaluate physical properties of the brain observed while evaluating "love"...it stands to reason that is what you were referring to....it is obvious now you weren't.....so, as it stands, your use of "Psychology" to counter It is relevant....because it is roughly the same pattern for anything else you love...there is no "specific" brain wave for the love of Mom...it looks like love for Dad...love for sister...love for a friend and love for jelly donuts. remains irrelevant.

Quote
Furthermore the original analogy you drew, you cannot prove 'love' so you cannot 'disprove' God, is a false analogy. The proper analogy, and response is.  You can prove whether or not someone experiences love and you can prove whether or not someone has had a religious experience. In fact scientists have been able to measure and reproduce religious experiences with magnetic impulses. (links will follow)

Don't bother....artificially reproducing a true experience is afterall....artificial....it says nothing about the nature of the original experience.....having someone with chronic central nervous/nueraxial pain and then illiciting pain by poking them with a needle tells us nothing about the true nature of the original pain.




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Battle is the most magnificent competition in which a human being can indulge. It brings out all that is best; it removes all that is base. All men are afraid in battle. The coward is the one who lets his fear overcome his sense of duty. Duty is the essence of manhood

-George S. Patton
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« Reply #50 on: February 15, 2008, 10:18:47 AM »

That's not what's relevant. What's relevant is reaction to mother vs. reaction to stranger.

It is relevant....because it is roughly the same pattern for anything else you love...there is no "specific" brain wave for the love of Mom...it looks like love for Dad...love for sister...love for a friend and love for jelly donuts.

But different from hate, I presume.

And all hate looks roughly the same also.
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Battle is the most magnificent competition in which a human being can indulge. It brings out all that is best; it removes all that is base. All men are afraid in battle. The coward is the one who lets his fear overcome his sense of duty. Duty is the essence of manhood

-George S. Patton
Factinista
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« Reply #51 on: February 15, 2008, 12:25:57 PM »

What you commented on: The chemicals and electronic impulses are also recognizably different for each. has nothing to do with Psychology


you know very little about psychology, neuroscience (which is what that statement is about) is a part of psychology.

Now if we will return to the topic of Theism(s).



The silliness of all other religions is obvious for most, but not of their own religion. Christians understand the obsurdity of the Cult of Athena and Hinduis see the sillyness of Islam...




All religion must be taken on faith, silly or not.
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Callum
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« Reply #52 on: February 16, 2008, 08:11:03 AM »

That's not what's relevant. What's relevant is reaction to mother vs. reaction to stranger.

It is relevant....because it is roughly the same pattern for anything else you love...there is no "specific" brain wave for the love of Mom...it looks like love for Dad...love for sister...love for a friend and love for jelly donuts.

But different from hate, I presume.

And all hate looks roughly the same also.

Depends what you are looking at.  The emotional reaction is the same, the intention of that emotion differs.  Given that strong emotion is a hefty changer of brain chemistry, but contents are all at the same level (the brain energy needed to imagine your Mum is the same as that needed for a jelly donut) and that is almost certainly much lower than the effects of a strong emotion, it is not surprising that it is difficult to separate the emotion from the cognitive aspect.

I'm not certain what point you are actually trying to make Pat.  Just the usual rubbishing of any philo or scientific investigations that don't agree with your dogma?  We are talking at a serious level here, not just using terms in their evryday ill-defined way.
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