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Author Topic: 35 Firms OK'd to Bid on Iraq Oil Deals  (Read 1196 times)
neue regel
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« Reply #60 on: May 05, 2008, 04:19:00 AM »

What IS and what SHOULD BE isn't always the same thing. We should have been taking steps long ago to allow American oil companies to go and find our own supplies. We have resources off the NC coasts. The fishermen are begging to have them drill. We should go anywhere we can find it.

Unfortunately, we've waited too long and now we are over a barrel...literally.
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Pond Scum
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« Reply #61 on: May 05, 2008, 06:55:31 AM »

What IS and what SHOULD BE isn't always the same thing. We should have been taking steps long ago to allow American oil companies to go and find our own supplies. We have resources off the NC coasts. The fishermen are begging to have them drill. We should go anywhere we can find it.

Unfortunately, we've waited too long and now we are over a barrel...literally.

Find our own supplies?

So you believe all of the "estimates" OF OIL RESERVES by the world experts are B.S.?
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Abraxas
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« Reply #62 on: May 05, 2008, 10:18:13 AM »

What IS and what SHOULD BE isn't always the same thing. We should have been taking steps long ago to allow American oil companies to go and find our own supplies. We have resources off the NC coasts. The fishermen are begging to have them drill. We should go anywhere we can find it.

Unfortunately, we've waited too long and now we are over a barrel...literally.

No.

What we should be doing is moving AWAY from a resource that causes global pollution AND global conflict.

We need to start phasing out oil consumption. Immediately. And we shouldn't promote the drilling of new areas in or around the US when we simply don't need it.
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
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« Reply #63 on: May 05, 2008, 11:05:48 AM »

 Oil from coal has now become economically feasible with $100 + per bbl oil. The coal shale deposits in Americas northwest are the fuel equivalent of 3 or 4 Saudi Arabias.
 Germany achieved oil independence during WWII by extracting their oil from coal, so the technology has been around a long time.
 Royal Dutch Shell oil is buying up the water rights in western Colorado for this expressed purpose right now. The development of oil from coal can be done sensibly and cleanly, if care is taken in the modernization of the technology. Every dollar oil increases in the world market price makes this alternative seem more attractive and more likely to happen.
 http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2007_Jan_19/ai_n17134974
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Abraxas
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« Reply #64 on: May 05, 2008, 11:21:05 AM »

That doesn't help. We're still using a limited resource that must be refined... and then refined again... to get the product we use today.

Also, searching for coal is enviromentally destructive, unhealthy and alltogether dirty. Now we're just polluting our country more.

We. Need. To. Move. On.
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
- Noam Chomsky

... you can almost see the high water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
- Hunter S. Thompson
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« Reply #65 on: May 05, 2008, 12:28:14 PM »

That doesn't help. We're still using a limited resource that must be refined... and then refined again... to get the product we use today.

Also, searching for coal is enviromentally destructive, unhealthy and alltogether dirty. Now we're just polluting our country more.

We. Need. To. Move. On.
I definitely agree Brax, we do need to move on to alternatives for fuel and propulsion means. However the entire country is not going to be driving a hydrogen / electric cars tomorrow. Coal to oil will aid the transition and has the best hope for gaining oil independence from the M.E. Coal to oil is not the single answer but it will be instrumental in solving our energy needs in the immediate future.
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neue regel
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« Reply #66 on: May 05, 2008, 12:51:53 PM »

Quote
What we should be doing is moving AWAY from a resource that causes global pollution AND global conflict.

As soon as a reasonable and profitable alternative is found, you can bet we will. Until then, the oil must flow. There is no other way.
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Abraxas
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« Reply #67 on: May 05, 2008, 03:51:10 PM »

Nuclear plants can be built in 5 years and can be used to create electricity and hydrogen. This can be botteled and sold to power hydrogen cars.

The only thing missing at this point is the infustructure needed to distribute.

We could be driving in hyodrogen cars and powering our houses with nuclear energy within your lifetime... if just SOMEONE would allow people to build a new nuclear reactor. People are gonna wonder why plants built in the 70's are prone to mechanical failures.

WELL THEN LET US BUILD NEW ONES!

We have the tools... we just lack the right people in charge.
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
- Noam Chomsky

... you can almost see the high water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
- Hunter S. Thompson
neue regel
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« Reply #68 on: May 05, 2008, 04:25:59 PM »

Quote
if just SOMEONE would allow people to build a new nuclear reactor

I'm with ya, bro...I'm right there with you.
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Ron Mars
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« Reply #69 on: May 06, 2008, 11:17:46 AM »


It is about securing a future source of oil which can be protected.


What is Bush waiting for then? Why aren't we controlling Iraq's oil industry today instead of the Iraqi Government? Returning control of Iraq back to the Iraqi people would completely destroy his double-secret plan for Iraq's oil.

In case you hadn't noticed, your often stated argument boils down to Bush banking on the next President and Democrats in Congress to implement his double-secret plan to control Iraq's oil exports? Bush sure as hell has no intention of doing it himself.

We have our own sources of "protected" oil in the Gulf of Mexico, Alaska and the Midwest we aren't using or even developing. We import relatively little oil from the ME.

The Bush's "war-for-oil" screech has as much credibility as the 9/11 conspiracy nonsense.
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Ron Mars
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« Reply #70 on: May 06, 2008, 11:59:35 AM »

Nuclear plants can be built in 5 years and can be used to create electricity and hydrogen. This can be botteled and sold to power hydrogen cars.

The only thing missing at this point is the infustructure needed to distribute.

We could be driving in hyodrogen cars and powering our houses with nuclear energy within your lifetime... if just SOMEONE would allow people to build a new nuclear reactor. People are gonna wonder why plants built in the 70's are prone to mechanical failures.

WELL THEN LET US BUILD NEW ONES!

Two weeks ago I attended the DESC Energy confrence in DC http://www.desc.dla.mil/dcm/DCMPage.asp?PageID=805.

The US Navy had a hydrogen powered car on display and I took the opportunity to ask the Naval Engineer some questions about the car and possible supplies of hydrogen.

It's range was about 200 miles. It used gaseous hydrogen (not liquid). It costs more to fill with hydrogen then gasoline (that could change obviously). Has an estimated mass production cost of around $60K-$80K per car. (The one on display was $240K to build.)

I asked about hydrogen supplies for millions of potential hydrogen powered cars. He believed that nuclear power plants was the only viable answer but couldn't handle the demand. He told me 300 nuclear power plants couldn't keep up with that kind of demand (he could be wrong). Taking hydrogen from water is far too energy intensive. He didn't believe hydrogen would ever take the place of gasoline as a fuel source for private vehicles in the near future. I've always believed hydrogen was the answer to gasoline. I had to change my opinion after talking with that Naval Engineer. It's a small part of the answer perhaps but the volume of hydrogen needed to power say 10 million cars is simply not available.

I do believe nuclear power can and will someday provide the majority electricity generation needs instead of fossil fuels. It's the best option for several reasons IMO.

We have the tools... we just lack the right people in charge.

Very early in the Bush Administration he asked for and got $15 Billion to be invested in hydrogen technology.
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« Reply #71 on: May 06, 2008, 07:55:59 PM »


It is about securing a future source of oil which can be protected.


What is Bush waiting for then? Why aren't we controlling Iraq's oil industry today instead of the Iraqi Government? Returning control of Iraq back to the Iraqi people would completely destroy his double-secret plan for Iraq's oil.

In case you hadn't noticed, your often stated argument boils down to Bush banking on the next President and Democrats in Congress to implement his double-secret plan to control Iraq's oil exports? Bush sure as hell has no intention of doing it himself.

We have our own sources of "protected" oil in the Gulf of Mexico, Alaska and the Midwest we aren't using or even developing. We import relatively little oil from the ME.

The Bush's "war-for-oil" screech has as much credibility as the 9/11 conspiracy nonsense.

You ask questions, I give you answers, then you ask the questions over again, and again, and again.

Last time.

IT IS NOT ABOUT STEALING OIL.

It is not about oil for today, or tomorrow.

It is not about oil next week, or next year.

It is about having a supply of oil for the NEXT 30 FLIPPING YEARS.

Have you looked at world production vs. consumption figures? Even including new discoveries, it is almost crunch time for oil. Something has to give. If demand continues even close to it's current pace, there is NO FLIPPING WAY PRODUCTION CAN INCREASE ENOUGH TO KEEP UP.

We are not running out of oil in the world, but we are running out of CHEAP OIL.

SO, YOU WANT TO KNOW WHY WE DON'T JUST START PUMPING AND TAKE ALL WE WANT RIGHT NOW?

Oil giant Exxon Mobil on Thursday posted the largest annual profit by a U.S. company — $39.5 billion US — even as earnings for the last quarter of 2006 declined four per cent.

The 2006 profit topped the previous record of $36.13 billion US that Exxon set in 2005.


IF WE GO IN NOW AND PUMP THE OIL, THEN IT LOOKS LIKE IT WAS A WAR ABOUT OIL. If we wait a little while, then well, not so much. wink, wink,

Come on, this isn't that hard to figure out.
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Pond Scum
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« Reply #72 on: May 06, 2008, 08:09:25 PM »

Until there is a cheap way to produce hydrogen, it is not economically viable. We need to invest in many different alternative energies right now, that are viable. Wind and solar are both viable, although more expensive than fossil fuels, they would be competitive in some areas if you take the corporate welfare away from current energy producers.

The one fuel that is totally overlooked though is biodiesel. Biomass is also overlooked for energy, since this would DECREASE the dependence of the people on energy companies.

Germany will have at least 20% of it's electricity generated from solar panels by 2020. Spain already has 25% of it's power from wind, Brazil has become energy independent through the use of Ethanol, but now it is looking to biodiesel.

WHY? Why are they now looking at biodiesel?



Brazil's Biodiesel Rush

The world's top ethanol producer has designs on becoming No. 1 in biodiesel production, too.

Now the country's left-leaning administration is moving ahead with a program that will make a blend of biodiesel—made from vegetable oils and ethanol—mandatory in the national fuel supply by 2008, with the expressed purpose of creating sources of income for many small family farmers in the poor, drought-plagued northeastern region of the otherwise fertile agricultural powerhouse. Officials associated with the massive soy crushing industry in the center-south, however, say the project is doomed without the scale of production that only it can provide to meet future output goals, but so far the government has not come up with the necessary tax breaks to make biodiesel production from soybean oil an attractive investment.



http://www.biodieselmagazine.com/article.jsp?article_id=380

Gee, why can't we do that?
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Abraxas
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« Reply #73 on: May 06, 2008, 08:33:55 PM »

We have the tools... we just lack the right people in charge.

Very early in the Bush Administration he asked for and got $15 Billion to be invested in hydrogen technology.

And how much money has he given to oil companies in the form of subsidies and tax breaks?

In 2005 alone he gave oil companies $4.3 billion in tax incetives LINK.
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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like its from Neptune.
- Noam Chomsky

... you can almost see the high water mark - that place where the wave finally broke and rolled back.
- Hunter S. Thompson
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