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Author Topic: Can somebody give me a crash course on US elections?  (Read 412 times)
Masterkoki
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« on: April 24, 2008, 06:00:24 AM »

I talked to an American friend of mine visiting Venezuela few days ago and told me he was a Clinton supporter and all of that. Then I asked him "How is a candidate elected president in the US?". I asked the question because I know that up there is different thatn Venezuela or the rest of South America for that matter. He couldn't really give me a comprehensive answer though, he said "well every state has 'points' and whoever wins that state wins the points. The guy with the most point wins". I found it funny and weird because elections in Venezuela are more simple in my opinion: the guy with the most votes wins.
I looked for more info on the web about the electoral system of the US and I got a headache, so If it's possible can anyone explain me this system like I'm 10 years old?
Also what is the Americans' opinions about this system? 
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Abraxas
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« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2008, 10:27:02 AM »

Here is Neue's post that got caught in the SPAM filter:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Electoral_College

This is how we elect the President. It is possible to win the popular vote yet lose the election, as we saw with Bush v Gore, in 2000. What you see now is a fight for the Democratic party nomination to run against the Republican party nominee, which already decided.

Hope this helps.
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neue regel
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« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2008, 11:49:53 AM »

It sure did...first time ever, too!!!    Cry
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Dormouse
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« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2008, 02:36:56 PM »

I talked to an American friend of mine visiting Venezuela few days ago and told me he was a Clinton supporter and all of that. Then I asked him "How is a candidate elected president in the US?". I asked the question because I know that up there is different thatn Venezuela or the rest of South America for that matter. He couldn't really give me a comprehensive answer though, he said "well every state has 'points' and whoever wins that state wins the points. The guy with the most point wins". I found it funny and weird because elections in Venezuela are more simple in my opinion: the guy with the most votes wins.
I looked for more info on the web about the electoral system of the US and I got a headache, so If it's possible can anyone explain me this system like I'm 10 years old?
Also what is the Americans' opinions about this system? 
Perhaps you are mistaking the present 'primary' process for the US Presidential election?  The Presidential election season hasn't even begun yet and really won't begin until September.

And when the Presidential election does occur, the Electoral College is the mechanism for determining the winner.  In the vast majority of cases, the winner of the national popular vote is the winner.  It is very, very rare for any other result to occur and that will happen only when the total popular vote is split almost perfectly evenly between two candidates.

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Masterkoki
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« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2008, 05:24:39 AM »

No, I sort of understand the primaries and the fight going on between Clinton and Obama to get the Democratic party nomination. I mean the actual presidential election like the one between Kerry and Bush 4 years ago or the Bush an Gore 8 years ago. The Wikilink helped a lot! Thanks Neue!

But I still don't get how this system is democracy-endowing since there can by a majority of people who vote for a candidate but the other one gets elected by the electoral votes. Is this a way to filter fraud attempts or to avoid having large cities to have a advantage over who gets elected?... I'm a little lost, sorry to be so ignorant about this issue Undecided
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neue regel
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« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2008, 05:39:50 AM »

http://uselectionatlas.org/INFORMATION/INFORMATION/electcollege_history.php

You are right that we are not a 'majority rules' democracy. The above link will provide some history as to how and why we arrived at our current system.

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I'm a little lost, sorry to be so ignorant about this issue Undecided

Don't be sorry. Asking is the best way to learn ... at least that's what I've found.  Smiley
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Abraxas
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« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2008, 07:49:14 AM »

It sure did...first time ever, too!!!    Cry

Happens to the best of us.
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Masterkoki
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« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2008, 08:20:24 AM »

Thanks again Neue... I'm calling you Neuepedia dude!

Well it's an old elections system as I see, but if it works for the americans then happy elections!
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neue regel
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« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2008, 08:24:34 AM »

Quote
Well it's an old elections system as I see, but if it works for the americans then happy elections!

I could see it eventually changing. It's worked OK so far.

You are from Venezuela?
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FreeinTX
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« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2008, 09:46:18 AM »

How elections work, the crash course.

I assume you mean for President.

The Bilderbergers get together and decide who they want to be President.

Then they relay that messege to the CFR and the TLC.  The CFR and TLC devise a plan to implement a strategy to make that candidate, "viable," in "public opinion."  They use their lobbists to influence politicians to support the candidate.  They use their media connections to focus on their candidates and ignore or slander other candidates. 

Then, they use their "BLACK BOX VOTING MACHINES" produce election results that jive with their wishes. 

Then, use things like "super-delegates" to sway elections further when the sway of black box voting (up to 20 percentage points) alone is not enough to close the gap.

Then, viola, you get the "democratically elected" President. 

How do we feel about it?

Presient approval rating - 28% WORST EVER IN HISTORY
Congress approval rating - 18% WORST EVER IN HISTORY
Media trustworthiness - 78% believe biased WORST EVER IN HISTORY

That's how we feel about it.

FreeinTX
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Masterkoki
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« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2008, 11:13:53 AM »

To Neue: Neue I'm Venezuelan. Specifically a Chavez-hating sociocapitalist culturalist Venezuelan.

To FreeinTX: Do you think in all past elections in the US it has been like that?, so fraudulent? 
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FreeinTX
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« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2008, 10:04:07 AM »

To Neue: Neue I'm Venezuelan. Specifically a Chavez-hating sociocapitalist culturalist Venezuelan.

To FreeinTX: Do you think in all past elections in the US it has been like that?, so fraudulent? 

Certainly, since JFK, when they blew his head off for trying to remove them from power.

Almost as certainly since FDR, and the BAD DEAL program that put us into MASSIVE debt with foreign bankers.

Probably, most likely, since 1913, and the ILLEGAL, UNCONSTITUTIONAL creating of the Federal Reserve.

And possibly, as far back as May 1st 1776, when the Illuminati was created to restore the United States back under British rule.

FreeinTX
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evollusion
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« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2008, 10:17:29 AM »

Masterkoki, don't listen to FreeInTX, next he'll try to have you believing that the mothership is on the way and he's going to get spirited off to Haley's comet.  He's what we in the US call a conspiracy theorist, and they are normally at best unbalanced

The short answer is that a when states hold elections for the President each state has a specific number of delegates, or as your friend said, points.  These delegates are assigned by the population and some other metrics.  Now, when the ballots are all counted the candidate with the plurality or most votes in that state gets all of those delegates assigned to it.  For example if Texas has 25 delegates and a Candidate A wins the popular vote in Texas, Candidate A gets all 25 of those delegate votes when the electoral college convenes and technically elects the president. 

However, this process has good and bad points.  The best point about it is that the candidates generally have to visit every state.  If we did not have the electoral college the only people that a presidential candidate would have to woo would be those in the major population centers of the country.  Which would be the Northeast and the California in the west.  This would disenfranchise a lot of voters in what we call "fly over country" which by and large has a completely different set of values than those who are in the urban population centers.  The downside is that occassionally a presidential candidate does not have to receive the popular vote to get the presidency. 

For example, take a look at this map http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/election/map.htm.  This is a map of the 2000 election for the presidency.  You'll notice that the only states which went for Gore (blue) are those in the North Eastern part of the US and on our western coast.  These are heavy population centers in our country and have a completely different set of values than those who are colored red.  Gore won the popular vote, but Bush won the necessary amount of delegates.

Finally the United States is NOT a democracy.  Our system of government is a representative republic.  We elect our representatives through a democratic process and they are expected to represent our values when they go to Washington DC.  Although it doesn't always turn out like that.  laugh

It has

These delegates are part of the electoral college 
« Last Edit: April 26, 2008, 10:19:19 AM by evollusion » Logged

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FreeinTX
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« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2008, 12:31:03 PM »

Masterkoki, don't listen to FreeInTX, next he'll try to have you believing that the mothership is on the way and he's going to get spirited off to Haley's comet.  He's what we in the US call a conspiracy theorist, and they are normally at best unbalanced

Uhh huh, and until 1998, Lush Bimbo, insisted that the CFR doesn't exist.

But we certainly know otherwise, now that they have their own f-ck-n website, right evo?

Now they say, "Okay they do exist, but they have no power."

However, of the 18 Sec of Treasuries 12 have been CFR.
Of the 16 Sec of States, 12 CFR
Of the 15 Sec of Defense, 9 CFR
Of the 11 CIA Directors, 7 CFR
Of the 7 Heads of West Point Military Acadmies 6 CFR
EVERY SINGLE Supreme Allied Commander in Europe - CFR
EVERY SINGLE US Ambassador to NATO - CFR

GW Bush has 387 CFR in his administration.
Reagan had 313 CFR in his.
Clinton and Gore' campaign financed by CFR. 
Clinton and his wife are CFR.
Kerry, Dick Cheney, Gore, Reagan, George H. W. Bush, Gerald Ford, Richard Nixon, John, David & Nelson Rockefeller, Condolezza Rice, Paul Wolfowitz, Alan Greenspan, Colon Powell, Henry Kissinger, Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, John Edwards, Chris Dodd, Bill Richardson, Mitt Romney, Rudy Giuliani, John McCain, Fred Thompson, Newt Gingrich, even actress Angelina Jolie and Christian leader Billy Graham- CFR

Corporate members include:  Halliburton of Dubai, British Petroleum, Dutch Royal Shell, Exxon Mobile, General Electric (NBC), Chevron, Lockheed Martin, Merck Pharmaceuticals, News Corp (FOX), Bloomberg, IBM, Time Warner, and JP Morgan/ Chase Manhattan

Media members include: News Corp (FOX), General Electric (NBC), Bloomberg, Time Warner, Time, Newsweek, US News & World Report, Atlantic Monthly, and Forbes.

They even have thier own magazine;

http://www.foreignaffairs.org/

where they OPENLY DISCUSS globalization efforts that will remove the soverignty of the US, an impediment to the "New World Order," and our GOD-GIVEN RIGHTS, and impediment to ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT, ONE WORLD REIGION, and a ONE WORLD LEADER, that the CFR insists we will have "by CONQUEST of CONSENT."


All these popular names, all these powerful positions in and around our government held by the CFR, which touts a member list of only 4,000 people.  Up from 2,905 in 1992.  Name the President (D or R) and I can list the entire group of CFR in his administration.  From Harry S. Truman, and Dwight D. Eisenhower, through JFK and LBJ, to Reagan, Bush, Carter and Clinton.

It's ALL CFR, ALL the time.   

The group that OPENLY takes its orders from the BILDERBERGERS.  Now, that we live in the "Age of Information," you don't have to go to Washington DC, to the Library of Congress to read the books, and get the quotes and the references that link these people together.  In fact, you can look up the membership lists of the CFR, the TLC, and the Skull and Bones from your living room.

And while I have NEVER posted anything having to do with or supporting a belief in "motherships" or Haley's comet sprits, this idiot will insist I'm unbalanced because he has NEVER even taken the time to look for himself at the information I and other have tried to drive down his and people like his throat for YEARS, decades for some. 

But hey, they floridate our water (average 20 point decrease in IQ), practically force mercury laden vaccines into our arms (increased autism from 1 n 3,000 to 1 in 8  ), dumbed us down in our public fool system (20% of American senior CAN'T find America on a map), and LIE to us, without penalty or culpability, using "main stream media" with CLEAR conflicts of intrest regarding the stories they discuss on their "news" networks.  Those same networks that are owned by, guess who, the f-ck-n CFR.  And all of this is EASILY verified.  Just use google, or if there is something specific, just ask.

Again, not "motherships" and "comet spirits" but rather government corruption and a move toward a "New World Order" to enslave the people.  Now you, Masterkoki, being in Venezuala, right now, probably know a thing or two about government corruption, vote rigging, and hidden agendas, am I right?

These people don't believe that exists in our country.  What do you think about that?

FreeinTX
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