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Author Topic: Israel is 60 years old now  (Read 1479 times)
mdma
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« Reply #60 on: June 02, 2008, 08:32:32 PM »

kactus you lost your mind with definition of word annihilation? Annihilation would be if Israel would wipe hundred thousands per day without targeting specific Palestinians. Israel targets terrorists and  clearly improves in doing that with precision unlike time ago. Terrorists have families, can be around regular ppl, can sneak behind regular ppl and no normal Palestinian have nothing to say because he/she has no weapon in hand to defend his/her point. It shouldn't be Israeli concern but internal Palestinian affair. This is targeting of terrorists and not annihilation. Although i like your Pale-mind invents another term, there was genocide, holocaust, apartheid and now total annihilation. Like Palestinians use any proper term happened to normal ppl in different places and apply these to them when in reality what should be applied to Palestinians is term 'Saudi terrorists'.

In my opinion Israeli government shouldn't that friendly and just start randomly rocket Gaza and West Bank, banks, houses, schools or whatever they have there, anyway they never learn in those schools but arm c4.
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Patton
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« Reply #61 on: June 03, 2008, 08:33:59 AM »

I am pretty convinced that pretty much sums up why Israel is in such a mess.

What mess is Israel in?

As far as I know, she maintains her sovreignty.

Quote
IMO the biggest enemy to the state of Israel is the zionism policies that they hace pursued for decades.

What was wrong with the Oslo agreement?

IMO, the biggest enemy of Palestinians/Muslims is greed.
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Battle is the most magnificent competition in which a human being can indulge. It brings out all that is best; it removes all that is base. All men are afraid in battle. The coward is the one who lets his fear overcome his sense of duty. Duty is the essence of manhood

-George S. Patton
kactus
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« Reply #62 on: June 03, 2008, 11:32:31 AM »

Quote from: Patton
What mess is Israel in?
As far as I know, she maintains her sovreignty.

Israel maintains her sovereignty because despite having nuclear arms and receiving multi billion dollar defence contracts from US government she still has to have the full backing and support of the world's no 1 superpower to deal with her own domestic problems at the expense of the US tax payers. Without that backing despite all the hypes here they can not even defeat Hammas. Look this is not a popularity contest and I am the first person to say that the problem will not go away overnight. I am not even talking about peace at this stage. The point that I have been making many times and I make again is that maybe and just maybe if the israeli government takes the initiative and stops these illegal expansion and settlements into the OT it will take the heat off and atleast make israelis less vulnerable to an attack for now. This is a small step that the israeli government has to take as both parties are 'partners in crime'.

Quote
IMO, the biggest enemy of Palestinians/Muslims is greed.

Patton...Any reasonable person would hold these discussions and atleast attempt to find a solution. I may have oversimplified this but atleast am trying to find a different perspective to this than the usual arguments of victimising Israel and branding all the other parties as 'evil'. Pretty much the same as the Bush's mismanaged policy on 'war on terror' and the Iraq war really.


The article below pretty much sums it up:

Quote
Jews in Israel and around the world will commemorate May 14. It's the 60th anniversary of the State of Israel's founding. Thousands of other Jews everywhere along with everyone of conscience stand with the Canadian Palestine Support Network (CalPalNet). They cannot celebrate. They will not celebrate. They remember the Nakba. They know it continues. They condemn 41 years of occupation; the starving and bombing of Gaza; the oppressive Separation Wall; the theft of Palestinian land; the building of illegal settlements; the denial of the right of return; the killings, torture, imprisonment and harassment; the denial of basic human rights; and Israel's disdain for international law.

They "can (and) will continue (their) efforts to end these injustices, uphold international law," and support every UN resolution demanding it. "This is the only road map to peace." They, with millions of others, won't ever stop working for it.

Full article:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=8867

If you don't agree with this article after reading it or think it's biased fair enough I won't ask you why but surely it seems more rational than going down the path of 'annihilating Israel's enemy'. Certainly in my own mind I will ask what has the current zionist policy achieved so far?
« Last Edit: June 03, 2008, 11:36:29 AM by kactus » Logged
CharlesMartel
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« Reply #63 on: June 03, 2008, 07:06:32 PM »

Israel maintains her sovereignty because despite having nuclear arms and receiving multi billion dollar defence contracts from US government she still has to have the full backing and support of the world's no 1 superpower to deal with her own domestic problems at the expense of the US tax payers. Without that backing despite all the hypes here they can not even defeat Hammas.

Maintains her sovereignty and clearly one of the most successful states in the ME. Provides fuel and power to Gaza on a daily basis, in fact, Israel shuts the spigots down and there is international holy moral terror as a result. Palestine is one big refugee camp, kactus, you want to speak to domestic problems? The Palestinians also get backing from the US, I could look the number up it is significant, Israel supports that Palestine Proper as well.

Why is it Iraeli behavior is focused on so heavily, what of her enemies? Israel could defeat Hamas, today's conflicts where the media affects opinion wasn't always the case. Israel defeated several signicant armies, successfully overcame hostage and terror situations the world over, their history replete with it. But, they've never faced this evil. An evil not even expected to follow a shred of humanity laws during conflict. Does anyone expect when American or Jewish soldiers are taken that we'll ever get them back?

Quote
If you don't agree with this article after reading it or think it's biased fair enough I won't ask you why but surely it seems more rational than going down the path of 'annihilating Israel's enemy'. Certainly in my own mind I will ask what has the current zionist policy achieved so far?

I look at Israel after winning war after war, establishing a state of 7 million plus, an economic and thriving reality, known for a very tenacious intelligence agency, indeed, Isreal isn't or shouldn't be the focus here.

Indeed, tell me what Jihad has wrought, what has this current Jihadist refusal to recognize policy achieved so far? I'm seeing claims these are oppressed and refugee encamped peoples. Exactly what other policy would have seen Israel the more dominant figure here? They took a policy of survival, warfare when attacked, and refusal to step backwards in the face of mortal danger nor unpopular but necessary decisions.

Exactly like this current President of the United States.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2008, 07:20:32 PM by CharlesMartel » Logged
mdma
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« Reply #64 on: June 03, 2008, 08:42:54 PM »

Israel maintains her sovereignty because despite having nuclear arms and receiving multi billion dollar defence contracts from US government she still has to have the full backing and support of the world's no 1 superpower to deal with her own domestic problems at the expense of the US tax payers. Without that backing despite all the hypes here they can not even defeat Hammas. Look this is not a popularity contest and I am the first person to say that the problem will not go away overnight. I am not even talking about peace at this stage. The point that I have been making many times and I make again is that maybe and just maybe if the israeli government takes the initiative and stops these illegal expansion and settlements into the OT it will take the heat off and atleast make israelis less vulnerable to an attack for now. This is a small step that the israeli government has to take as both parties are 'partners in crime'.

Nice logic,
Israel removes all settlements > causes civil war because radical's energy would go somewhere else > Tel Aviv would be rocketed by Hamas as it close enough. Palestine doesn't recognize existence of Israel but the same time IS a legitimate and democratically chosen government of Palestine.
Seen that, when half of settlements moved from Gaza strip rockets came into Ashkelon which never was a part of Palestine, of course not 67' borders Palestine.
In your last sentences where you sound like carrying mother almost made me cry.


Patton...Any reasonable person would hold these discussions and atleast attempt to find a solution. I may have oversimplified this but atleast am trying to find a different perspective to this than the usual arguments of victimising Israel and branding all the other parties as 'evil'. Pretty much the same as the Bush's mismanaged policy on 'war on terror' and the Iraq war really.

Patton has a solution and this called reality, you just fail to read him but of course a 'reasonable' person like you have a 'reasonable ' with which most of us here disagree so we do attempt to discuss.


The article below pretty much sums it up:
Full article:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=8867
If you don't agree with this article after reading it or think it's biased fair enough I won't ask you why but surely it seems more rational than going down the path of 'annihilating Israel's enemy'. Certainly in my own mind I will ask what has the current zionist policy achieved so far

Of course its more 'reasonable' and this is very reason why those 'reasonable' Canadian Jews live in Canada and not in Israel. I hope Israel would annihilate its enemies at least once so we would share common feelings and then maybe i will become reasonable like you are.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2008, 08:44:48 PM by mdma » Logged

notin
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« Reply #65 on: June 05, 2008, 01:17:39 PM »

Quote
Do you REALLY want to go over the factual history once again??


hell no, bro, it takes no effect on you. Arabs were indigenous, in that, most of them wer born there from parent who also were born there from parent who were born there. Jews were not indigenous, in that they absolutely came from outside. The Arabo-Zionist conflict for Palestine is a conflict of natives and aliens for control over land. Full stop.

Quote
Maintains her sovereignty and clearly one of the most successful states in the ME.

as long as the daddy is paying the bills. States falling short of self-reliance are hardly "most successful".

Quote
IMO, the biggest enemy of Palestinians/Muslims is greed.

those greedy bastards in the refugee camps...nothing satisfies them, always demand more...gotta keep those money-grabbers under gunpoint at the checkpoints, or else they gonna come all over New York and wrap their greedy hands around banks, trusts and newspapers. Greedy Palestinian bastards.
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a big pile of bs covered with a thick layer of sugar
CharlesMartel
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« Reply #66 on: June 05, 2008, 01:22:10 PM »

as long as the daddy is paying the bills. States falling short of self-reliance are hardly "most successful".

She has fought her wars, defended her soil, and been militarily brilliant at times. A clear recipient of US aid, however, still one of the most successful nations in the region....no?
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realityman
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« Reply #67 on: June 05, 2008, 03:39:34 PM »

Quote
Do you REALLY want to go over the factual history once again??


 Arabs were indigenous, in that, most of them wer born there from parent who also were born there from parent who were born there. .

LOL... And I'm oh so anxious to see you back that up with FACTS Peisi... Or is that just one of those "assumptions" you'd like this forum to accept on your word??  Wink

(but let me guess, you're going to try to cloud/distort the issue with accounts or references to how many Arabs were in the region at various times... Which certainly does not back up/prove your statement above  Wink

Love your "interesting" definition of "indigenous" too (but don't let that divert you from proving/supporting your "grandparents" point  Wink)
« Last Edit: June 06, 2008, 04:32:16 PM by realityman » Logged
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