Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

neorealist

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Re: Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2008, 06:36:33 PM »

its not wasted IMHO...and those people don't work if the plant isn't producing.


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Fredledingue

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Re: Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2008, 04:19:01 PM »

It depends what you mean by "wasted".
The missile defense shield planned to be built in Poland is, IMO, a huge waste of money. The probability that Iran launches an ICBM with a nuclear warhead at Europe is realy realy small. Even if Iran develop or aquire the technology to build such ICBM, Iran will be bombed to the stone age before they start production.
Then even if Iran succeed in build them, and that the missile shield works, Iran will still have plenty of targets against the West which won't be under the umbrella range.
Notably, the target #1, Israel won't be covered.

What Bush want to create is a "We can and we do build anti missile shields" to maintain the impression of US militaro-technologic superiority. While in fact, it has not much real use to such installation.

Now if it's to develop and experiment new technologies, it's not a waste. My point is that you don't need to do it in Poland and create diplomatic problems to do that.


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neorealist

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Re: Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

« Reply #17 on: September 14, 2008, 05:28:17 PM »

Quote from: Fredledingue on September 14, 2008, 04:19:01 PM

Its all about point of reference...you aren't a US citizen working in the defense sector. You aren't a Polish supplier included in the agreed offsets...you aren't a Polish citizen who just became a little more uncomfortable after the Russian-Georgian war.


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mdma

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Re: Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

« Reply #18 on: September 14, 2008, 08:33:34 PM »

Fred, i thought your intellectual development level allowed you to understand that American defense system in Eastern Europe never intended to be against Iranian attack of Europe.

If Israel will be attacked by Iran with nuclear warhead this means Arabs will eat the same attack because anywhere you hit Israel you hit at least one Arab country with it. Iran won't exist after such attack. It will be bombarded by all Israeli cannons and then by NATO's as check fire. Probably then NATO will gain control over oil structures.


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notin

Peisithanatos

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Re: Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

« Reply #19 on: September 17, 2008, 02:07:40 PM »

Quote

you aren't a US citizen working in the defense sector

how about US citizens working in the dildo-production sector (OK, all the dildoes come from People's Republic)? Its THEM who pay to the defense sector. Its not the Polish and Hungarian taxpayers who'll pay for the stuff. It will be you, buddy. The thing is, to your arms industry people, American taxpayers dollars are as fine as that of the Polish taxpayers dollars. The USA doesn't earn a dime on the thing; the money changes hands within the US flying from your pocket to the pocket of the arms industry folks. Don't try to present the Missile Defense project as a lucrative deal for the US. The one who pays for it is you, not the Poles.

Quote

you aren't a Polish citizen who just became a little more uncomfortable after the Russian-Georgian war.

uncomfortable hardly. Few see the Georgia war as an omen to Poland. And then, if a Pole were to perceive a military threat from Russia, the missile deal is the most extravagant way to respond to it. In the prospect of a Russo-Polish war, that deal changes nothing.


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a big pile of bs covered with a thick layer of sugar

Fredledingue

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Re: Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

« Reply #20 on: September 22, 2008, 05:23:14 AM »

Poles (the population) and other east europeans are against the missile shield project precisely because they know it stirrs up tension with Russia.
Poland is a very corrupt country and if the american poured a few dollars in the Twin-President pockets (the Kacinski brothers) they get the deal.

As I said Ahk, american defense industry employees can keep their job and work on another project or be transfered to the Nasa's Jet Propulsion Lab.
And polish contractors and corrupt politicians can get US tax-payer money for other services than this one.

It's about time the US politicians get rid of the cold war mindset. And if McCain is elected, you will be stuck in 60's for another 4 years. It's time that Condy goes retired too.


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neorealist

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Re: Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2008, 08:05:00 PM »

Quote from: Fredledingue on September 22, 2008, 05:23:14 AM

Poles (the population) and other east europeans are against the missile shield project precisely because they know it stirrs up tension with Russia.
Poland is a very corrupt country and if the american poured a few dollars in the Twin-President pockets (the Kacinski brothers) they get the deal.

As I said Ahk, american defense industry employees can keep their job and work on another project or be transfered to the Nasa's Jet Propulsion Lab.
And polish contractors and corrupt politicians can get US tax-payer money for other services than this one.

It's about time the US politicians get rid of the cold war mindset. And if McCain is elected, you will be stuck in 60's for another 4 years. It's time that Condy goes retired too.

considering NASA is a non profit org that might be a difficult.

Also:

"According to the new poll, 58 percent of those surveyed support the missile defense plan — compared with 30 percent in March 2007, early on in the negotiations. The poll was published in the Rzeczpospolita daily."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26269478/

Looks like the Russian incursion into Georgia has some ramifications.


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Fredledingue

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Re: Ah, The Truth Arrives About The Missile Defense That Is "Tweaking The Bear"

« Reply #22 on: September 27, 2008, 01:15:28 PM »

Yes, maybe.
But it will be unusable against a Russian attack. I don't think there will be a war with Russia in the nex 50~100 years anyway.

This georgian war has had a psychological effect. Nothing rational.


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